Feedback on Instructing at PSIA/CSIA Ski Schools

[Sidney]

Hi,

I'd like to get some feedback from people who know about teaching and getting hired at ski schools (non-PMTS). I'm seriously after information on this and not a bash or discussion on PSIA or their deficiancies.

I'm not PSIA or CSIA certified and from what I know it's difficult to get into a ski school especially in North America and Europe if you don't hold these (or similiar) credentials. Moreover if I were to try and get into a ski school to instruct, what if can demonstrate clean and complete carving (good releasing, transfer and engagement)?? Would I not be taken seriously because I'm a first time instructor? Irrespective of my skiing and/or teaching ability just because I've never taught TTS before? Would it mean I start at the bottom of the teaching chain no matter what??

I know there are on-snow interviews for the ski schools to see your skiing/teaching ability, but if I don't demonstrate the wedge or a push up/off for a release, would they try and change my skiing/teaching to teach the wedge and up and unweighting??

Thanks.
Sidney

[Volkskier1]

Ski schools in the US are hungry for bodies. They dont even care if you can ski. They'll get you a visa, house you in some crummy dorm pay you $6 an hour and teach you a wedge so you can teach it to 4-5 year olds and they can collect their $150 a day times 10 kids.

Most ski schools will honor foreign certification.

[ToddW]

Sidney,

In the US the quota for the main seasonal worker visa program has already been reached for the coming season. There's a thread on this over on Epic. If you're looking for a spot this season in the states, you should find someone with good immigration / labor law background to help you find a solution. Does anyone know what the employment situation is in Canada for Australian persons?

Ken and Icanski are PMTS accredited instructors who teach in traditional schools and post on this forum. Slava is a PMTS green instructor who reportedly taught in a traditional school for a while. You might try sending them a PM asking for their answer to your question.

I'm not an instructor, but here are two facts you should think about.

• Most students are never-evers, and even most L3 PSIA instructors teach many beginner and low-level intermediate classes because there aren't too many advanced students taking classes.
• Practice makes permanent.

Have you considered trying to find a spot at Solvista, Tahoe Donner, or Tyrol Basin where your PMTS background would be a plus?

Good luck.

[Sidney]

Thanks Todd,

I know the visa process for the United States is quite difficult, it's much easier for Australians to get one to Canada.

That's what I figured regarding the teaching. It won't be for this coming winter but probably for the one following one in New Zealand or Australia. One of the resorts here interviews at the end of this season. I'd consider Solvista but I'd like to get a accredited in PMTS first.

Sidney,

In the US the quota for the main seasonal worker visa program has already been reached for the coming season. There's a thread on this over on Epic. If you're looking for a spot this season in the states, you should find someone with good immigration / labor law background to help you find a solution. Does anyone know what the employment situation is in Canada for Australian persons?

Ken and Icanski are PMTS accredited instructors who teach in traditional schools and post on this forum. Slava is a PMTS green instructor who reportedly taught in a traditional school for a while. You might try sending them a PM asking for their answer to your question.

I'm not an instructor, but here are two facts you should think about.

• Most students are never-evers, and even most L3 PSIA instructors teach many beginner and low-level intermediate classes because there aren't too many advanced students taking classes.
• Practice makes permanent.

Have you considered trying to find a spot at Solvista, Tahoe Donner, or Tyrol Basin where your PMTS background would be a plus?

Good luck.

[Sidney]

That "almost" sounds enticing...

Ski schools in the US are hungry for bodies. They dont even care if you can ski. They'll get you a visa, house you in some crummy dorm pay you $6 an hour and teach you a wedge so you can teach it to 4-5 year olds and they can collect their $150 a day times 10 kids.

Most ski schools will honor foreign certification.

[Mac]

Sadly, from what I've seen of the current ski school situation, Volklskier's comments are probably correct. I was offered a job once as an instructor, my reply was that I wasn't qualified to teach anyone, and the response was "it doesn't matter, as long as you can ski better than the people you're teaching, they will think you're God." I've known resorts to grab people out of the maintenance crews around the busy holiday weeks, give them instructor jackets, and tell them to get out there and teach classes. Sad but true.

[Mac]

By the way, ToddW, that story came from your favorite resort. Be careful who you take lessons from!

[ToddW]

By the way, ToddW, that story came from your favorite resort. Be careful who you take lessons from!

I knew there was a reason I'd declined free lesson coupons. (I'm more concerned that they at least do lift maintenance better than their corporate brethren at Mt. Bachelor -- did they offer you a lift mechanic job too?)

If you ever do put on one of their instructor jackets, I might just consider taking a lesson

[Mac]

Todd, as I said before, I'm not qualified to teach anyone, no pins or plaques, just some Nastar silver, but if you want to meet up to ski sometime, we can get together and compare notes.

[ToddW]

Mac,

It's always a pleasure to meet and learn from fellow PMTS skiers. I've always respected your opinions here and on the other forum, and it would be nice to meet you. (Fair warning: I'm even further from having pins and plaques than you are, but I'm eager to improve.)

-todd

[Mac]

If I expressed my opinions on the "other forum" too often, I would probably be enjoying the same status as Max and Bolter right about now. Too bad, because Epic is not the same place that it was when I joined on. I still believe the vast majority of members there share the same interests as most of us. I think if you took an anomynous poll over there, I think you would find that the majority of members disagree with the way the site is being run. But then again, it's not a publicly owned site, they can do whatever they want, it's there to serve the interests of a few, so be it.

[Mac]

Todd, I think our paths may have crossed already, if you are the same guy I'm thinking of, at Sol Vista last February. My friend Bill, who is a veteran of five camps, and I were riding the lift at Sol Vista the Sunday before the camp started, and we observed a number of campers (they are easy to spot) doing drills out on the hill. When we were walking through the parking lot at the end of the day, we recognized you as one of the campers we had seen on the hill, and made some small talk as we loaded the Jeep. It seems to me that the person said that they were from NY, and skied mostly at Killington/Pico. Just wondering if you were that guy?

[ToddW]

Yep, that was me.

[tdk6]

Be prepared to start at the bottom but its better than being incompetent at higher level. And I think its pritty cool to teach beginners since with them you can teach without having them unlearning first. First timers are actually not a bad group of people from an instructor point of view. Especially if its a private lesson. I have been instructing at various different locations and its 90% your attitude that counts. Your attitude and how you interact with your students. If you are good with your students and they book more lessons I bet nobody will get on your case even if you dont teach exactly what is expected. As long as its good skiing. Dont forget to be nice to your boss and co-workers.

[Ken]

Sidney

The ski area where I teach has a large instructor corps...200+ part time instructors and 20+ full timers. The outfit always wants more full time instructors, who'll work 6 or 7 days a week during early winter and less at the end of winter. Housing is decent but no village/night activities here. It is a short drive from the city. Last year they had a large group of Argentine instructors (on their summer college holiday) plus an Aussie or Kiwi (they sound the same to me). You probably already know more about U.S. immigration than I do.

The area trains just about anybody who can ski fairly well and hires them. The area states that PSIA membership is required, but they never check. PSIA certification brings a higher pay rate. They'll train and examine for Level I. The job will be for beginners and low level intermediates, but assignments go to anyone who'll step forward and accept the work, so there might be a few higher level assignments. Training is simple...just follow their lead. The thing taught least and very important is class management. What one teaches the students here is pretty much up to the instructor, although wedge is the only way they want beginners to learn. As soon as the better athletes have had their first two hours of wedging (and leaning to to buckle their boots, step into their skis, ride the lift, side stepping, etc), I get them tipping, and the not-so-athletic learn tipping as soon as they can progress past that compulsory wedge.

You would have NO problem being a successful instructor at this area or many others. Decide where you want to spend the winter and get application letters in the mail early before that winter. You may also find additional employment as a boot fitter in the evenings.

As always, the keys to being a successful instructor are class management and spotting the single most important thing for each student to work on. Class management includes keeping a group of children together, safe, and having fun while learning skills as well as picking the right run in that day's snow for a private client. The single most important thing for each student to work on yields the biggest improvement for the time spent, and requires analysis from the instructor. It isn't pure movement analysis as much as total analysis...is the student back on their heels, or leaning back toward the hill out of fear, etc. Sometimes just getting the student to balance over the outside toe is well worth the two hours, then tipping, etc., can work for them. Always remember that getting the single most important thing for that student right is more beneficial to that student than teaching six things that they never master.