Purchase skis or continue to rent

[SkiDad]

Background:
I just started skiing last year, as a 53-year-old. I have a total of 8 days on the slopes. I took the family up to Vermont (Smugglers Notch) this year over the holidays; we took lessons every day and by the end I was "level 3". Virtually all of my skiing so far is on green trails, but I am committed to mastering this sport. My kids, 7 and 13, love skiing. My 13-year-old son started skiing three years ago and gets to ski more than I with various groups during the season. In Vermont he was doing blues, blacks, moguls, and off-trail. My 7-year-old daughter is a natural, and she will soon catch up with my son. I want to go with them. We are probably likely to do mostly East Coast skiing for the next couple years.

Questions:
Should I buy skis now? I already own a helmet and boots (Tehnica Diablo Spark). My thought is that if I have my own skis, I will have some continuity each time I ski and thus improve more rapidly.

If I do buy skis, which ones? I went to the local ski store last weekend, and the sales person's recommendations, based on what they had in stock, were to either: (a) buy skis that are at my current level, or (b) buy skis for the next level up (he thought I should do the latter). In the first category, he suggested:
K2 Commanche 3
Head XRC 500
Atomic Sativa
In the second category (higher level), he suggested:
K2 Stryker
Dynastar Legend 4800
Atomic High Noon
Rossignal B78
In addition, by kicking around websites, reviews, etc., I (non-expert) thought the following skis might fit in the second category:
Fischer RX Fire 8
Head Xenon Xi 9.0
Volke AC 30

So, I would be grateful for any thoughts on whether I should buy now and, if so, which one. If you have views on which of the categories above I should be looking in (at my current level, or my next level), which of the above skis I should take off the list, any skis I haven't mentioned that I should consider, etc., I would be very grateful.

Thanks for reading through such a long-winded message.

[Mac]

Congratulations on making a commitment to the sport. There's nothing that can be more rewarding than spending a day on the slopes with your family. I would say that you should definitely buy your own pair. That would give you some consistency, as opposed to renting an unfamiliar pair of skis every time you hit the slopes, especially since the quality of the tunes on rental equipment can vary considerably, and really effect the performance. Not to mention having to go through the rental line every time you want to ski. Deciding on what pair to buy is somewhat of a crapshoot. It would make sense to buy a pair that you can grow with, unless you look forward to buying a new pair every other year. I would not go with the last three on your list, they are more in the expert level. But you might want to think about the Head Xenon 7.0 instead of the 9. I know of skiers with limited experience that have really taken to that ski. You also might want to think about attending one of the PMTS camps in the future. If you're commited to getting better, that's the fastest way I know of for anyone to advance rapidly. And no, I'm not a headhunter for Harald, he has no trouble selling out his camps, but I have seen too many people that have come through his camps that have made remarkable progress not to be impressed.
I also live and ski mostly in New England. Next time you are going skiing, let me know where, and maybe I can point you in the direction of a good ski shop that would let you demo some skis.
Good luck.

[Mac]

Congratulations on making a commitment to the sport. There's nothing that can be more rewarding than spending a day on the slopes with your family. I would say that you should definitely buy your own pair. That would give you some consistency, as opposed to renting an unfamiliar pair of skis every time you hit the slopes, especially since the quality of the tunes on rental equipment can vary considerably, and really effect the performance. Not to mention having to go through the rental line every time you want to ski. Deciding on what pair to buy is somewhat of a crapshoot. It would make sense to buy a pair that you can grow with, unless you look forward to buying a new pair every other year. I would not go with the last three on your list, they are more in the expert level. But you might want to think about the Head Xenon 7.0 instead of the 9. I know of skiers with limited experience that have really taken to that ski. You also might want to think about attending one of the PMTS camps in the future. If you're commited to getting better, that's the fastest way I know of for anyone to advance rapidly. And no, I'm not a headhunter for Harald, he has no trouble selling out his camps, but I have seen too many people that have come through his camps that have made remarkable progress not to be impressed.
I also live and ski mostly in New England. Next time you are going skiing, let me know where, and maybe I can point you in the direction of a good ski shop that would let you demo some skis.
Good luck.

[SkiDad]

Mac,

Thanks for the advice. It's good to know that I'm not jumping the gun by purchasing skiis now. I'll try to check out the Xenon 7.0 this weekend.

[Mac]

Getting a good fitting pair of boots should always be your first priority, but a decent pair of skis is really a no brainer for anyone other than just a casual skier. I would really look into the Xenon 7, I have just heard too many good things about it from a wide variety of skiers of all abilities. Of course, there are always deals to be had on last year's leftover stuff, and I'm sure there's something that would be suitable for you out there. But considering that the Xenon 7 is not a super expensive ski to begin with, and should serve you well for many years in a wide variety of conditions, than the cost becomes pretty reasonable. Where are you planning on skiing this weekend?

[SkiDad]

Mac,

I wish I was going skiing this weekend! At this time, the closest to skiing for me may be Pres Day next month -- we have a place booked at the Wintergreen Resort in Virginia (we live in the DC burbs). But I will try to get out for at least a day of skiing before then.

I called the local ski store and they do have the Head Xenon 7.0 in stock, which I will check out this weekend. The sales guy said they sell the Xenon shorter than normally, and suggested that I consider 163 cm. Of course, they only have the 156 and 163 in stock. I'm 5'9", and when I plug that into the Head "Product Advisor" it suggests that I go for 170 cm. What do you think?

Also, depending on what I input for "tempo" in the Head Product Advisor, it suggests that I also look at the Xenon 5.0. Any thoughts on that compared to the 7.0? And, for what its worth, the guy at the store thinks I should take another look at the K2 Stryker -- although from what I read that may be over my level for now.

Third, you mentioned boots. I have the Technica Diablo Spark. OK? Or ditch?

Any thoughts you may have on any of the above would be most welcome.

Thanks very much.

[ginaliam]

Ski Dad,

I'd plug for buying "up"-especially in this category-all-purpose frontside carving skis-as the higher end models do not mean that they require vastly better skills to get similar benefits from them (some skis-race skis, big-mountain skis can really up the ante in stiffness and skier input but none of the skis you've listed are in this category). So take all the skis in your first category off the list.

If you're going to be using these skis as you one and only pair-even in New england-I'd err a little on the side of longer (i.e the Xenon 7.0 in a 170cm over the 163cm--afterall-170cm is still pretty short!).

In the k2 line-I'd go with an Apache Crossfire over the stryker
In the Heads- the 7.0 should be fine--but the 5.0 is probably a little too low-end.

The Fisher RX8 Fire is a great ski-but it'll be a while before you acquire the skills to really appreciate it--do they still make an rx 6?

I am presently skiing a Dynastar Contact 9 (165cm) as my frontside ski and I love it and think even an aspiring skier could enjoy this ski

The Rossi B78 and the Dynastar legend 4800 are different skis all together (all-pupose midfats) of the two the 4800 is the better ski. In fact, that might also be a great ski to consider.

Some folks will tell you to demo a lot of skis--but-being a beginner, honestly, you won't really have the skill set yet to really know which ski will work better for you in the long run--FORTUNAtely, most skis today are really good regardless of manufacturer-it looks like you're on to the right sort of ski for where you ski and your ability level-the Xenon 7.0 in a 170cm is probably just about perfect (or a k2 Apache Crossfire in a similar length).

Oh-and the boot fit-like everyone says that's the most important factor!

Have fun-buying gear is a blast--and get yourself out to a hill sooner than president's week!

Liam

[Mac]

You are probably right on the bubble as far as length is concerned. You could go with either the 163 or 170, and neither choice would be wrong. I do know that Head's Product Advisor tends to err on the long side of things. If I plug my info in, it tells me I should be on a 175 Supershape, but the 170 is all the ski I would want. Same thing with the iM 75 Chip of a few years ago, the Product Advisor said 184, I ended up buying the 177, and was glad I did, the 184 was just way too much ski. Also, a friend of mine that is your size was in the same situation a few years back, he ended up going with the Head XRC in a 163 and was happy with his choice. The K2 Stryker has a good reputation as a mid level ski, as does the Dynastar 4800. However, the turning radius of the Stryker is much larger (17+) than the Xenon (13+), and I know that Harald prefers a ski with a smaller turning radius for most situations. In truth, I can't really advise you on most of these skis, as I haven't skied them, all I can do is repeat the positive feedback I have heard. From what you have said, it sounds like the shop guy that you are dealing with has given you good advice. And I agree that demoing can also be confusing if you try too many different pairs. As far as the boots go, as long as they fit and are comfortable, I would stick with them for now, as that should be your main concern, at least for now. Let us know what you decide on. And if you're ever in New England again, let me know, maybe we can hook up.

[SkiDad]

Liam and Mac,

Thanks much to both of you. I read your messages this weekend before going to the local ski store. I looked at the Xenon 7.0 but didn't buy yet. My hesitation was the price tag ($650), since I might be moving up in two years. The guy at the store (different guy from the previous week) said that if I was concerned about "amortizing" my first pair of skis, as an alternative I could get the Dynastar "Distinct" model with bindings for $400. He also said that unless I've got a week or two more skiing planned yet this season (I wish!!), it wouldn't hurt to continue to rent and then look for new skis in the fall. Since that went against his store's short-term interest in selling me skis now, I decided to hold back on a purchase and reflect on it, at least til next weekend.

I'll keep you posted. Thanks again.

Liam, why did you recommend the K2 Crossfire over the Stryker?

[proball19]

I was also looking at the K2 Stryker and K2 Crossfire, based on a recommendation at the local ski shop. I'm returning to skiing after about 10 years off, but I grew up skiing a dozen times a year in the North East. Im renting now, with the intention to buy in the coming months.

At 6'1" and 240 pounds (athletic build ) is the Crossfire at 174 cm a better ski simply because it's stiffer? I'm probably a level 6 now. Thanks, and I didn't mean to rob this thread. But I think the responses would help SkiDad, too.

P.S. Why did the local ski shop tell me not to look at the Volkl AC30? Too stiff/advanced? Isn't it similar to the K2 Crossfire?

[SkiDad]

The Crossfire may be beyond my current skill level, although I would still be interested in Liam's view.

One other thing sticks in my head from my discussion with the sales person at the local ski store last weekend: when I asked to look at the Head Xenon 7.0, he said something like "great ski, but it is primarily a carver." In response, I felt like saying "yeh, just what I want!", but he had already told me he'd been skiing for three decades, so I fell back to "uh huh...." Can someone explain his statement to me? I thought carving was a good thing. In my limited amount of time skiing, the only way I know how to turn is to tilt my ankles so my skis are on edge, and the skis go into a turn. Isn't that carving? Except in the West, when skiing on powder, what's wrong with a "primarily carving" ski?

These may be dumb questions, so go easy on me in your replies.

[ToddW]

SkiDad,

Your gut intuition was right.

Ski store salespeople know that most of their "intermediate" and "advanced" male customers overrate their own skiing ability when buying skis and boots. Sadly, most "intermediate" skiers skid (tails and tips slide unequal distances) more than they edge (whether edge-locked or with equal brushed displacement of tip and tail), so a ski designed to catch an edge won't satisfy these customers. The salesman's comment about the Xenon being "primarily a carver" was likely a test to see if you would reply that that's exactly what you wanted and to steer you away otherwise.

If you tip/tilt to turn, odds are high that you'll prefer carving skis. This weekend, I met a couple at Killington who've been attending PMTS camps and private lessons for years. Actually, I saw their elegant skiing and chased them down the mountain to talk to them. They were on new Head Supershapes that they'd ordered from Harb Ski Systems, and they called them their "magic skis." The magic is that they carve and hold an edge so sweetly when tipped.

... what's wrong with a "primarily carving" ski?

Absolutely nothing. They're a blast to ski on and will put a huge grin on your face. You may even wind up calling them "magic skis"

[SkiDad]

Todd,

Thanks. This helps put it in perspective for me. I'll be going back to the ski store this weekend. Also, I'll look into taking a PMTS class.

SkiDad

[Michael]

Skidad,

One thing I would strongly consider doing is to demo the skis before you buy. Assuming the demo skis are tuned and waxed, you can get a much better feel for the ski by trying it and comparing it to others you try. Generally, the cost of the demos will be taken off the price of the ski if you buy it from the mountain shop.

Michael

[François]

I think you should buy your own equipment just so you don't have to line up and do the rental thing every time you go skiing. Having some consistency in your skis and boots will help too. Most people insist its easier to learn on beginner skis, but I think you should err on the side of more advanced skis. I agree you want a carver unless you are skiing pretty deep snow. The reviews at expertskier.com are pretty good.