Another video, comments appreciated

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Another video, comments appreciated

Postby Tommi » Sun Feb 18, 2007 8:39 am

Hi all,

Check this:
http://personal.inet.fi/perhe/antila/videos/salla2.wmv

This is skied 'from the hard disk'. The skier is not 'trying' anything. Slope is red, surface very easy.

Conditions were quite awesome!
http://personal.inet.fi/perhe/antila/videos/salla.jpg

I'd like to get insight into the problems the skier is showing in this video:
- what causes the ski tips to diverge? As you see, it's much worse on the right ski, in left turns
- why is the hip movement much better when turning right?

The divergence causes other symptoms, like the stance getting wider during transition.

Ciao,

T2

Comments appreciated.
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Postby alan » Sun Feb 18, 2007 3:09 pm

Just practicing my analysis from what I learned from camp this week. Someone with some experience please let me know what I got right or wrong:

Bad Things:

1) On the release (both right and left turns)- Steps onto the little toe edge of the new outside ski while keeping the old outside leg fairly straight. This is more pronounced when transitioning from right to left turns. He should be flexing the outside leg to match the flex of the inside leg at the end of the turn.

2) First Third of the turn (right turn)- Pushes off the stance leg and throws weight onto the inside leg (watch the snow spraying off the skis). Since the weight is transfered to the inside ski there is less resistance in the outside ski to allow the outside leg to flex easily for the next turn transition. He should remain flexed at this point and simply tip the skis until the skis reach the fall line, then let the outside leg extend by flexing the inside leg more and tipping the inside leg. When this is done the pressure should build on the outside leg edge instead forcing the pressure with a push on the outside leg edge.

3) First Third of the turn (left turn) - The step to the new outside ski and up move is much more pronounced when transitioning from the right to the left turn, which is probably why the left turns are worse. The skis are in the fall line by the time they are released from the right turn because the right turn was not completed before trying to transition to the left turn. There pretty much is no first third of a turn when going left, so this is probably why it looks worse than the right turns.

4) Bottom Third of the turn (right turn) - Pretty much doesn't exist, the transitions are happening to early, probably caused by the problems from 1) & 2) Look at how upright and facing down the fall line the skier is when transitioning from a right to left turn.

5) Inside ski tip lead. Needs to focus on pulling the free foot back. This is probably leading to some counteracting problems, but I can't see the zipper on the jacket to clearly, so I'm not exactly sure how the counter acting is working.


Good Things:

1) Once the skis have been released and the skis are tipped on edge there is decent counterbalancing angles between the upper and lower body.

2) The skier is developing strong edge angles once on the edges.

3) The skier is turning by trying to tip the skis and not turn them.

4) Even though there are faults with the skiing the skier still looks better and is more effective than 90% - 95% of the skiing public because of the good things he is doing.
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Re: Another video, comments appreciated

Postby Max_501 » Sun Feb 18, 2007 7:04 pm

Tommi wrote:- what causes the ski tips to diverge?


Because the skier is so far back in the video I'm having a tough time getting a good look at the movements. This is what I see (could easily be incorrect).

1) Too much weight on the inside ski which causes it to hook up and diverge.

2) Take a look at the skiers hips and shoulders as he passes the camera...are they too far back?

3) In the transition to the left turn there seems to be an up movement and very little high c engagement. Is that a push off movement? It doesn't look like the inside foot is leadig the tipping.
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Postby h.harb » Sun Feb 18, 2007 7:33 pm

Max has it right, I would address the push off move first (which is very strong) as it includes some inside ski tipping in the exercises and that might get rid of the divergence.
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Postby Tommi » Sun Feb 18, 2007 11:23 pm

Ok, guys, thank you for excellent comments. The 'camp' continues, more videos will follow..

Ciao,

T2
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Postby tdk6 » Mon Feb 19, 2007 6:03 am

Tommi, are you on a camp in Salla?

Alan, in proper MA you have to start off with the good stuff ;), but other than that, very nice MA.

IMO the skier in the video skis well; good rhythm, flow, speed etc. Hard to tell if he is even trying to ski like Mario Matt. Yes, inside ski weighting causes skis to diverge and outside ski to skid away. Also on his left turn he rotates out with his hips a bit causing that outside ski to skid away. Is he too far back? Maybe, but so is Bode and Byggmark. Too far back in the transition is not a big problem as long as there is extention inot the turn.
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Postby Tommi » Mon Feb 19, 2007 7:06 am

Hi TDK,

Actually not, just some vacation. Lots of Essla (alpine club) people are here, and some junior racers. They seem to have a camp, as they were having GS practise today early morning, hrr.. Pretty cold approx -20C, otherwise very nice. Snow is very dry, off-slope is soft to the bottom.

I worked on the divergence today. I made some single ski ski stuff. Very useful seemed to be the flexing drill using exaggerated wide stance. One problem is inadequate extension and mistiming the extension.

Here is one more video of me today:
http://personal.inet.fi/perhe/antila/videos/salla3.wmv

The slope is blue, which makes things easier.

It was fun to monitor the youngsters trying to keep the speed up. The slope is quite soft with very dry loose snow on top.

From this video you can clearly see the problem in the transition. Inside ski is not leading the tipping..

Practise continues.. tomorrow maybe some kiteskiing.

Thanks for all comments.

T2
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Postby Max_501 » Mon Feb 19, 2007 7:47 am

tdk6 wrote:Is he too far back? Maybe, but so is Bode and Byggmark. Too far back in the transition is not a big problem as long as there is extention inot the turn.


First of all, we don't do the ILE extension into the new turn in PMTS. I think HH covered that well in another post.

When a skier decides to crank up the intensity of the turns being in the back seat at transition will jet the skis. You can see this in my video on occasion. In addition you won't be getting the ski engaged early with pressure so you lose potential to bend the ski for speed control. So, a strong free foot pullback is need to control the fore/aft balance.

Bode is a world class athlete so that fact that he does it is not really applicable for our recreation skiing. Also, while he does do it and get away with it much of the time, doesn't it also lead to some of his problems in the course?
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Postby tdk6 » Mon Feb 19, 2007 7:54 am

Nice skiing and truly beautiful scenery! Stunning!

I cannot really comment on your skiing that much because it looks very good to me. Your skis are tracking very nicely and you seem to be in good balance. One thing that strices me is that your left arm is raiced up front and your right arm is dropped down. This gives your skiing a slightly odd appearance.

BTW, a good friend of mine is working as an instructor in salla. I know many essla coachse too.... have fun.
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Postby tdk6 » Mon Feb 19, 2007 8:08 am

Max_501 wrote:
tdk6 wrote:Is he too far back? Maybe, but so is Bode and Byggmark. Too far back in the transition is not a big problem as long as there is extention inot the turn.


First of all, we don't do the ILE extension into the new turn in PMTS. I think HH covered that well in another post.

When a skier decides to crank up the intensity of the turns being in the back seat at transition will jet the skis. You can see this in my video on occasion. In addition you won't be getting the ski engaged early with pressure so you lose potential to bend the ski for speed control. So, a strong free foot pullback is need to control the fore/aft balance.

Bode is a world class athlete so that fact that he does it is not really applicable for our recreation skiing. Also, while he does do it and get away with it much of the time, doesn't it also lead to some of his problems in the course?


I agree with you that being in the back seat is a bad thing. And you are perfectly right that if this happens during transition the classic skis up the hill and in the air move is near at hand but I was merely refering to the fact that during transition the skier can appear to be in the back seat but he is not. I could not see any balance flaws in the video indicating too much back seat sitting.

Did not read HH posts but you are saying that in PMTS there is no ILE. How do you describe the extention into the turn? If there is flexion in the transition there has to be extention in to the turn as well, or? BTW, your skiing is great.
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Postby Max_501 » Mon Feb 19, 2007 8:29 am

Tommi wrote:From this video you can clearly see the problem in the transition. Inside ski is not leading the tipping..

Practise continues..


The quality of the new video is superb! This is perfect example of what a video should be if you want detailed MA of your skiing.

I would suggest working on the timing of your tipping movements and flexing. In the video you can see that you are pushing off of your new outside ski before the old outside ski is released.

Also, when carving turns like you demonstrate flex the outside leg and allow it to track back up next to the inside foot. That way the skis will be close together for the transition.
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Postby tdk6 » Mon Feb 19, 2007 9:01 am

Max_501 wrote:In the video you can see that you are pushing off of your new outside ski before the old outside ski is released.

Could you please explain this a little.... Im not really shure what you mean.

Max_501 wrote:Also, when carving turns like you demonstrate flex the outside leg and allow it to track back up next to the inside foot. That way the skis will be close together for the transition.

Are you saying that the skis should be closer together, close stance, at transition but wide apart while in the turning phase? And when exactly do you suggest we flex the outside leg?
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Postby Max_501 » Mon Feb 19, 2007 9:40 am

TDK, I'll provide some detail later today (off to the slopes to train my son).

Tommi, next time out how about trying a couple of runs doing a weighted release before you work on the tipping. Its a great way to remove the push off move.
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Postby Tommi » Mon Feb 19, 2007 12:30 pm

Max, I think you hit the nail. Single ski carving and weighted release are the drills to perfection.
I'm afraid some of my problems are alignment related. I have new boots, and the current cuff adjustments are not large enough. I'll let HH or his staff analyse my alignment in Hintertux..

Otherwise, the fit of Doberman 130 is excellent. The only drawback is that the fit is so snug that I have to wait for 10min in the cottage to get the boots off ;-b Race snug boots are very nice to ski.

Tomorrow's forecast has some high winds.. let's c if I can ski early in the morning before it gets nasty.

Again, lots of thanks to all for analysis.

T2
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Postby h.harb » Mon Feb 19, 2007 1:21 pm

Tommi, thanks for the video great scenery, the trees are like some of the interior ski resorts in Canada like Silver Star. Watching your video is more proof that your skiing ( releases, push off etc. which people have right) is an alignment issue rather than a movement issue. Your movement issues are due to your knocked kneed boot stance.
Do your feet move inside when you tip?
If you can get the thickness of three credit cards along the inside of your boot soles, big toe edge, to tip you further out at the knees, this will be good. In other words, lift the big toe edge side of the boots. This will make a world of difference. Please send us new video after you try this. We will definitely get it right at Hintertux.

Also try to ski with both little toe edges on the snow at the same time. I know this sounds weird, but it will reduce the knee drive and give your CM more time to move accross.
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