Pole Plant Timing.

[Bob]

I?d like to get some opinions on the timing of pole plants while performing aggressive short radius turns on steeps slopes vs. pole taps while cruising on less steep terrain.

While the books do a wonderful job of explaining and dissecting proper pole use and technique, I question my timing. I believe I have a good idea of the proper mechanics, but still question the timing of my plant in relation to my release.

Using a short turn on a steeper slope, where a solid plant is required, this is how I proceed. Midway through the arc (say 3 o?clock), I hope to have my stance leg extended, and my pole tip is moving toward the fall line due to wrist action and maybe some slight movement in my elbow.

From somewhere in between 3-5 o?clock (depending on how aggressive the arc), I am beginning to relax my stance leg. By 5-6 o?clock position I am more weight on the LTE of uphill ski. At this point, I PLANT and flex aggressively towards my NEW LTE.

Assuming my mechanics are solid, my question is more of timing.

Does the above timing seem appropriate? Comments, questions, and discussion would be welcome. Thanks.

[NoCleverName]

I'm having a hard time visualizing this. It could be "defensive" or almost "blocking". I also can see how standard timing could be pretty scary on steeps. I think I use standard timing with a lot more punch than tap. I also probably leave the pole planted too long.

But more importantly: does the late plant let your pole fall behind you, giving you a slight arm-induced rotation? I would think that would be bad. I think I might be doing that myself, come to think of it because my pole stays planted too long.

[SLAVA]

SkiersSynergy (one of HH camps coach) put together a very good pole plant lesson

Skier: HH ( 2006 mt. Hood race camp)

http://www.web.pdx.edu/~petersj/Skills/Videos/PolePlant.wmv

[Bob]

Thank you for responding and suggesting this video.

I have watched this video before. Like the books, it is well produced and does a wonderful job at dissecting the mechanics of proper pole use.

My initial question still remains.

The video lesson comes closest to answering my question when it reads, ?the pole plant signals the release?. So does this mean that I have not started to relax my stance leg at ALL prior to the plant?? I did not think that this was the case. This is where I would like further understanding.

[Max_501]

The video lesson comes closest to answering my question when it reads, ?the pole plant signals the release?. So does this mean that I have not started to relax my stance leg at ALL prior to the plant?? I did not think that this was the case. This is where I would like further understanding.

Very insightful question. The release is often gradual with the leg relaxing yet still engaged. The pole plant signals the actual edge release (edges moving to flat) and should precede that movement. So, in a release that is gradual I plant after I have started relaxing but before I move to flat.

Of course, that's just how I do it. I could have it wrong.

[patprof]

Bob-I'll take a shot at this. I too struggled with the pole plant timing thing. Here is what works for me. As I am coming back across the fall-line and ending the previous turn, I do two things simultaneously: I reach down the fall-line with my pole arm and at the same time I press down gently on my uphill ski (I call this re-centering). I still have some weight on my downhill ski and I try not to lose any of my counter-balancing. Only then do I pole tap and release. So the pole tap initiates the release. The reaching and re-centering are done prior to the release. As Harald points out in his new book-the pole swing movements should be independent of the upper and lower torso. The secret is to not let the pole arm movements take you out of counter or rotate the upper body. If you do-you'll lose all that stored energy from the previous turn. You want to save that energy for the release. If you get it down-you'll almost be propelled into the next turn! Very powerful and neat feeling (also addictive!)

[Hobbit]

Two years ago in the all mountain camp our group was coached by Bob Hintermeister and he gave us a simple formula:

"flex, pole and roll [your ankles]"

This pretty much describes the sequence, so you are supposed to hold the edge when you begin to flex.

[Bob]

Thank you all for your replies.

Max, I think your comments put things in good perspective. While in my mind, I'm beginning to release as I'm relaxing the stance leg, the actual release occurs as the edge itself flattens and then rolls.

Hobbit, I had the pleasure of skiing with Bob Hintermeister last season. It was not until you mentioned it that I too can know recall him saying "Flex, pole, roll"!!

Thanks again.

[Rookie]

On numerous occasions (books, videos,) and even in the video clip posted by Slava in this thread -- Harald seems to be using poles which are very long. Just view it again. The standard response you get from shops is the "hold it upside down below the basket... and you should be at 90 degrees."

As I have struggled with a proper pole plant, I sometimes wonder if my poles are too short... because I really feel as though I am having to "reach" too far.

What kind of lenghts are people using out there? Does it appear to others as though Haralds poles are fairly long?

Rookie

[Max_501]

What kind of lenghts are people using out there? Does it appear to others as though Haralds poles are fairly long?

I ski with the standard shop rule of thumb or a bit shorter if I'm spending some time in the bumps.