Jeff said:
So, maybe the question is: If a short turn is not "purely" carved, does it follow that it has to be pivoted? In my opinion, this does not necessarily follow.
Tommy said:
My current position is that in a non-purely-carved-turn there has to be some amount of pivoting or rotation occuring, which causes the skis, or at least the aft part of the skis, to skid. like a rallye car's tail.
Here is my opinion:
Just because a turn is not "purely" carved does not mean that it is either rotated or pivoted. It simply means that the edge is not gripping throughout the turn. I *think* that this lack of grip is simply caused by actions higher in the turn (or perhaps lack of action) which cause the ski to break loose. For example, I think that a sloppy release/engagement could cause this. I know from experience that, once a turn starts out with a skidded component it is very difficult for me to bring it to a pure carved turn, so I just try to make the next turn better. My point, however, is that this skidded (?) non-purely-carved turn is easy enough to achieve without resorting to rotating or pivoting.
Like others, I'm still learning to carve. Until I reach that day when I can carve at will, many of my turns have a non-carved component. I believe that this is caused by poor engagement skills on my part, not by rotary or pivoting movements.
Prior to encountering PMTS, I had never had a lesson (except for the Alta "Lesson From Hell") nor had I ever read a book on skiing. I learned to ski crappily by watching others ski crappily. The only TTS techique I ever consciously acquired was the wedge and this for survival. So, while I have had to work in eradicating the wedge entry, I don't
think that I have much rotating/pivoting in my turns. (I'd like to hear from Harald if he has ever seen this in my skiing and will stand corrected if so.) If I have acquired rotary/pivoting movements, then it has certainly been inadvertent. So, since 1) I don't always carve and 2) I don't think that this comes from rotary/pivoting movements, then I think that it comes from sloppy engagement. Therefore, it is possible to have a non-purely-carved-turn without pivoting or rotation.
A word on terminology. If you turn, then your skis rotate. By this I mean that, from the perspective of the fall line, the tips/tail go from 10 o'clock/4 o'clock to 2 o'clock/8 o'clock. This is more of a "geometric" definition of rotation. When I tip my free foot, my free foot femure rotates, followed by stance femur rotation (more/less depend on knee/ankle flexion). This is more of an anatomical definition of rotation. If I use the large muscles of my legs to "torque" my skis, then this is a technique definition of rotation. AFAIK in my skiing, the geometric and anatomical rotation is occuring, but not the rotation techique.
I make these distinctions because I wonder sometimes what a poster exactly means when the term "rotation" or "pivoting" is used. Given this, I don't even know the "technique definition" difference between rotation and pivoting.