PSIA SKi Instructors Think they Know how to ski

Friends get together

PSIA SKi Instructors Think they Know how to ski

Postby skijim13 » Tue Feb 06, 2018 4:57 am

Every time I get back from another camp my friends who are ski instructor's watches our skiing and thinks what we learned in camp makes our skiing worse. Last week I was working on something from camp which required me to keep a very narrow stance to get feedback on tipping of both feet equally since I was raising the tail of my right foot too high since my left hamstring is weak from an injury. Walter suggested to feel the inside arch touch the boot side as an external clue to how high I am lifting the boot, this is combined with the release and tip lift. Mark told my wife that skiing with the feet close together is completely wrong, she said that is why we ski using PMTS vs PSIA and he should just leave it at that.
skijim13
 
Posts: 475
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 9:17 am
Location: Nazareth PA USA

Re: PSIA SKi Instructors Think they Know how to ski

Postby HeluvaSkier » Tue Feb 06, 2018 8:14 am

Your new goal should be to ski so well that they are too intimidated to speak to you. :twisted:
Discipline is the refining fire by which talent becomes ability.

www.youtube.com/c/heluvaskier
User avatar
HeluvaSkier
 
Posts: 1387
Joined: Sun Oct 30, 2005 7:29 pm
Location: Western New York

Re: PSIA SKi Instructors Think they Know how to ski

Postby skijim13 » Tue Feb 06, 2018 9:16 am

Working on that, Camp #5 in two weeks. Lorie overhead a race coach using me as a model of upper lower body separation.
skijim13
 
Posts: 475
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 9:17 am
Location: Nazareth PA USA

Re: PSIA SKi Instructors Think they Know how to ski

Postby HeluvaSkier » Tue Feb 06, 2018 10:40 am

Jim,
Are you and Lorie still thinking you'll make it up my way at some point this season?
Discipline is the refining fire by which talent becomes ability.

www.youtube.com/c/heluvaskier
User avatar
HeluvaSkier
 
Posts: 1387
Joined: Sun Oct 30, 2005 7:29 pm
Location: Western New York

Re: PSIA SKi Instructors Think they Know how to ski

Postby ToddW » Tue Feb 06, 2018 2:18 pm

HeluvaSkier wrote:Your new goal should be to ski so well that they are too intimidated to speak to you. :twisted:


Heluva,

This has got to be one of the all-time great skiing quotes!

Todd
.
ToddW
 
Posts: 472
Joined: Sat Feb 03, 2007 8:41 pm
Location: live: Westchester (NY) / ski: Killington

Re: PSIA SKi Instructors Think they Know how to ski

Postby Max_501 » Tue Feb 06, 2018 7:29 pm

skijim13 wrote:Mark told my wife that skiing with the feet close together is completely wrong, she said that is why we ski using PMTS vs PSIA and he should just leave it at that.


That is a huge difference from what a PMTS coach would tell you. I'm guessing that your camp coaches suggested inside foot management as an area to work on?
User avatar
Max_501
 
Posts: 4055
Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2005 7:39 pm

Re: PSIA SKi Instructors Think they Know how to ski

Postby skijim13 » Wed Feb 07, 2018 4:56 am

Max I am working on inside right foot tipping more since I tip too fast and raise the foot tail more than the other, the other thing I am working on is the pelvis CA I was adding to much upper body turning to increase my CA more than my pelvis.

H
skijim13
 
Posts: 475
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 9:17 am
Location: Nazareth PA USA

Re: PSIA SKi Instructors Think they Know how to ski

Postby skijim13 » Wed Feb 07, 2018 4:58 am

Heluva,

Hope to get up there after Lorie and I attend the next camp. One of my videos from camp is posted on my facebook page.
skijim13
 
Posts: 475
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 9:17 am
Location: Nazareth PA USA

Re: PSIA SKi Instructors Think they Know how to ski

Postby l2ski » Wed Feb 07, 2018 7:46 am

Maybe you should have him see you free ski medium turns and try to get good vertical
separation while keeping the free foot close to the stance. Would he then say you have a narrow stance?

I was told the same thing by an instructor last year while I was practicing a slow two footed release from
stationary start.
l2ski
 
Posts: 103
Joined: Thu Sep 18, 2014 10:31 am
Location: New Jersey, USA

Re: PSIA SKi Instructors Think they Know how to ski

Postby DougD » Wed Feb 07, 2018 10:03 am

skijim13 wrote:Mark told my wife that skiing with the feet close together is completely wrong...

Will Mark be in Korea? He could help Hirscher and Shiffrin widen their stance.
DougD
 
Posts: 572
Joined: Thu Apr 10, 2014 6:22 am
Location: Connecticut, USA

Re: PSIA SKi Instructors Think they Know how to ski

Postby dewdman42 » Wed Feb 07, 2018 10:45 am

I have spent a lot of time trying to walk the fence between both worlds. PSIA instructors don’t understand PMTS as harald has pointed out countless times. Their feedback about your skiing is meaningless. Their point that you are using PMTS and they are using PSIA and leave it at that is the truest thing they have said to you. They should leave it at that and if I were you I would flatly ignore any other “advice” they try to give you. The higher up in PSIA they are, the more likely they are to try to correct you in ways that are opposIte to what you’re trying to accomplish and will be detrimental to your skiing.

Here are some of the things they will try to get you to conform to, and detrimentally to your skiing:

  1. widen your stance
  2. push on your outside ski with early and hard extension to generate high c pressure
  3. do not lift your inside ski off the snow even a tiny amount, ever.
  4. twist your legs more to initiate turns, steer turns and create upper lower separation
  5. keep your skis flatter on the snow don’t tip them so high on edge. This facilitates steering (their way)
  6. recenter yourself through transition by projecting your pelvis forward using extension, up and over drill
  7. avoid early counter balancing and counteraction ( they will use different words ).
  8. create edging by angulation ( their newest junk science )
  9. stand up taller in general while skiing
  10. master pivot slips they are the key to eveything

Truthfully, PSIA is not even remotely close to PMTS; they endorse and push certain movement patterns that are diametrically opposite of what the best skiers in the world and PMTS are doing. They might get by with that nonsense on easy groomer hero snow and with lower level skiers, but they will never become a truly top shelf skier that way. A lot of them are even quite adept and graceful at demonstrating their backward ideas on easy terrain and they are all working really hard to master those poor techniques on easy terrain. They love to stand around and criticize each other over PSIA minutia. None of that is of ANY use to you! As helluva said, your goal should be to get so good they don’t know what to say. Even then some of them will still criticize the PSIA minutia because an awful lot of them are so far down the rabbit hole they can’t see the forest from the trees. And let’s face it, unless you are skiing dead nuts perfect, their PSIA trained eyes will be looking out for the above flaws and quick to conjure up a theory for how your imperfect skiing would be improved by widening your stance or some other PSIA based theory that is usually flat out the opposite of true, lacking any understanding of what you are actually doing or trying to do.

Bottom line, don’t listen to them!
dewdman42
 
Posts: 511
Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2006 11:52 pm

Re: PSIA SKi Instructors Think they Know how to ski

Postby HeluvaSkier » Wed Feb 07, 2018 11:17 am

I do wonder why any dedicated PMTS skier even remotely cares what a skier who neither uses, nor coaches, PMTS movements has to say about their skiing.
Discipline is the refining fire by which talent becomes ability.

www.youtube.com/c/heluvaskier
User avatar
HeluvaSkier
 
Posts: 1387
Joined: Sun Oct 30, 2005 7:29 pm
Location: Western New York

Re: PSIA SKi Instructors Think they Know how to ski

Postby blackthorn » Wed Feb 07, 2018 11:41 am

Heluva asks
I do wonder why any dedicated PMTS skier even remotely cares what a skier who neither uses, nor coaches, PMTS movements has to say about their skiing.



Altruism ???
blackthorn
 
Posts: 192
Joined: Sat Dec 21, 2013 1:33 pm
Location: South Island, New Zealand

Re: PSIA SKi Instructors Think they Know how to ski

Postby h.harb » Wed Feb 07, 2018 7:29 pm

As soon as a PSIA instructor tells me he uses some of my stuff, I get concerned because he's giving PMTS a bad name. There is only one way to use PMTS correctly, and that is after you are an accredited, Bonafide Certified, instructor.
User avatar
h.harb
 
Posts: 6772
Joined: Sat Feb 03, 2007 2:08 pm
Location: Dumont, Colorado

Re: PSIA SKi Instructors Think they Know how to ski

Postby h.harb » Wed Feb 07, 2018 7:30 pm

Max501 is a Blue Level.
User avatar
h.harb
 
Posts: 6772
Joined: Sat Feb 03, 2007 2:08 pm
Location: Dumont, Colorado

Next

Return to Social Chatting

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests