Lito videos

[PeteJE]

I have e relied on Lito videos for parallel turn and turn transition. Is this proper technique? Seems very similar to pmts but without the emphasis on the step by step tipping / phantom move breakdowns. I am not looking for a rehash of arguments, but, as an intermediate, I stumbled onto pmts after learning and practicing from the Lito videos. They work great and it's fun to progress with; I was curious if Lito is sharing / teaching the same techniques ( ie: he seems tofocus on "early" weighting change and body moving across towards the new turn whereas ptms focuses on feet / ankle tipping). Both look like phantom move, but with slightly different way of describing how to get there?

[h.harb]

The difference is in Lito's videos he shows and uses extension and rotation, we don't adhere to either of these movements in PMTS. We use flexing and tipping, which totally changes the picture of your skiing and connectivity between turns.

[PeteJE]

Thank you for the quick reply. I have acquired your Expert Skier 1 book and will work through it and the exercises. I was curious because, watching Lito's feet in his videos, there seems to be great similarity. I was hoping there is some harmony between these two methods of instruction as opposed to poor skills or habits that must be broken / relearned.

[HeluvaSkier]

I was hoping there is some harmony between these two methods of instruction as opposed to poor skills or habits that must be broken / relearned.

I think you will find there are some things to un-learn. By working through book 1 you are already on the right track.

[PeteJE]

I was hoping there is some harmony between these two methods of instruction as opposed to poor skills or habits that must be broken / relearned.

I think you will find there are some things to un-learn. By working through book 1 you are already on the right track.

This part I don't quite understand, but you don't know what you don't know, lol. It seems to me that Lito emrbaces and teaches from the feet up and presents one footed balance, the stance that flows from that, and the phantom move fron the get go.

[suxsusy]

I'm the last one who could speak about that because i'm unexpert, but i've tried 40 years the traditional system (steering, twisting, up movement to lighten the skis and turn) having not good reward.
In my opinion PMTS is unique and it has got nothing in common with other systems.
For what i read, everything is different from the movements to the time to do those real movements, the pole planting, the
position and distance of the skis.
I think in PMTS there's no space for something else. It should work perfectly so as it is
One has to chose : PMTS or not-PMTS
Bye
Susy

[HeluvaSkier]

This part I don't quite understand, but you don't know what you don't know, lol. It seems to me that Lito emrbaces and teaches from the feet up and presents one footed balance, the stance that flows from that, and the phantom move fron the get go.

See Harald's comment above. The way he has designed PMTS is quite unique as teaching systems go.

[hyper_squirrel7]

I'm the last one who could speak about that because i'm unexpert, but i've tried 40 years the traditional system (steering, twisting, up movement to lighten the skis and turn) having not good reward.
In my opinion PMTS is unique and it has got nothing in common with other systems.
For what i read, everything is different from the movements to the time to do those real movements, the pole planting, the
position and distance of the skis.
I think in PMTS there's no space for something else. It should work perfectly so as it is
One has to chose : PMTS or not-PMTS
Bye
Susy

Yeah, but it's hard sometimes. PMTS kept me from dumping skiing altogether, but sometimes it gets tiring to fight between learning pmts and doing what you did before. In emergencies you always revert back; it sucks. With most friends when it's just about fun, it's hard just have fun(since you'll just go wedge, steering, etc when not actively thinking PMTS) when you always just want to practice PMTS. Usually when it gets too annoying I just switch into my snowboard and go, LOL.

[PeteJE]

I am unique a bit in that I come from fat, short ski boards to skiing. I rode 110 cm long, 120mm underfoot, shaped cambered boards (no poles). They were riden parallel carving only (well lots and lots of slarving and lean lol). When I moved to skis (from end of last season), I never used a wedge except for utility around lifts, crowded run outs, etc.

I can get around and control speed very sloppily, but from a parallel, skating type of beginning attempts vs. wedges and all that flows from that. For me, the Lito videos got me going with an understanding of what I was trying to do for control and carving. Gladly, I soon after found PMTS and look forward to more (hoping for a camp week in the next years season or two). I find enjoyment in learning and progressing as the free riding around gets boring quickly when stuck in the intermediate rut with sloppy movements.

Still early in book one, so, lots to work through.....

[Mac]

Keep in mind that Lito's first two video's (Breakthrough on Skis 1, Expert Skiing Simplified, and 2, Bumps and Powder) were filmed before the advent of shaped skis, and all the video was filmed on the old straight skis. except for a short segment that showed some powder skiing on wider skis when powder boards were still in there infancy. Lito's 3rd video, Breakthrough on the New Skis, came out about the time when deep sidecut skis were becoming popular, and takes on a more PMTS style approach. But back in the early 90's when Lito's first book and video came out, it was a real revelation for skiers (like myself) who were struggling and getting nowhere with traditional lessons.

[Skiasaurus Rex]

Yeah,

Lito's last iteration of that book included a lot of references directly to Harald, 'Phantom edging' and a picture of him skiing, I think. Lito called Harald something like 'the most gifted coach in skiing.' Lito's phantom edging, narrow stance, early weight shift, 'dynamic anticipation (counter acting), one footed skiing, focus on the "foot the whole foot and nothing but the foot", and open disdain for TTS style progressions were all good vanguards into the world of modern skiing. His books/ videos belong in the same historical lineage as Witherell.

BUT, he stopped running his clinics and writing his books right around the time Harald was perfecting and promoting the ever-upgraded PMTS, so Lito had a lot of old-school still in his books whereas Harald is still improving and sharpening the teaching of good skiing.

Jerry Berg's skiing in the Lito video series is solid in any genre.

And no one, I mean no one, in the world of ski instruction writing has the engaging and gifted Prose of Lito Tejada Flores. There's something captivating about the way he discusses technique that just makes you want to ski, and that was a very big part of his success and influence. Has anyone read his 'Soft Skiing' book, or whatever that last one was called? I haven't read it, but I'd like to see if he ca still spin the same magical weave of writing.

[Mac]

Jerry Berg was one of my early role models, his skiing was always an inspiration to me. He could ski better on the old straight skis than most people can on the new stuff. Just a dynamic skier. Was really saddened to hear of his passing a few years ago. Just goes to show how vulnerable us humans really are.

[h.harb]

Lito did deviate from PSIA to some extend, before I had met him. And he wanted to evolve his technical ideas even more. I introduced him to the Phantom move and PMTS. He totally and really liked it and I allowed him to write about it on his own terms. His last book is almost totally devoted to the Phantom Edging. Lito is a gentleman and a very good writer. However some of his demonstrations and descriptions are his interpretation of the early PMTS ideas and not completely PMTS there is old stuff mixed in. It is not how we would use PMTS or how PMTS has developed in the last ten years.

This is well stated and totally factual. Thank you Susy for appreciating the work that has gone into PMTS, which is a totally different system, as you stated. It's it hilarious that a skier, who has been a customer of TSS for years can recognize this and PSIA instructors can not.
I'm the last one who could speak about that because i'm unexpert, but i've tried 40 years the traditional system (steering, twisting, up movement to lighten the skis and turn) having not good reward.
In my opinion PMTS is unique and it has got nothing in common with other systems.
For what i read, everything is different from the movements to the time to do those real movements, the pole planting, the
position and distance of the skis.
I think in PMTS there's no space for something else. It should work perfectly so as it is
One has to chose : PMTS or not-PMTS
Bye,
Susy

[Basil j]

I just watched "Lito's lesson 3 -carving" on you tube as I have heard much about him but never have read or seen any of his work.A younger Harald Harb is featured in it quite a bit in the video demonstrating Phantom edging.. Lito called it Phantom edging and did not dive into flexing to release or tipping, like PMTS does, but none the less it was interesting to watch. I think PMTS digs much deeper into technique and movements as a whole system with one movement building to the next and so on, which I fond much more appealing.

[skijim13]

We have a friend who started skiing with us last week from the ski club. The problem is that he thinks he is an expert skier and the main reason is because he has watched all the Lito videos and said he skis like him which is not true. His turns are not good, he leans into every turn has no edge angle and has his inside ski almost bonded to his outside ski causing him to wipe out in many turns. His ego is so big he had been telling us how to improve our skiing, as well as a friend of mine started teaching PMTS to this year, the person from the ski club believes that he has found the secret to expert skiing. A funny thing happened last week is that he told us and others he uses Dynamic anticipation in all his turns, (which I believe from Lito videos is his version of counteracting). I asked him to explain what it is, and his answer is he has no idea how to explain it but he uses it in his turns. I have bought and watched many ski training videos and books, everyone other teacher of these programs tells you what you should be doing to make good turns. However; they all provide no roadmap on how to do the movements or how to validate if you are doing them correctly, until I found PMTS. The PMTS system is the only program out there I have found that gives you a step by step learning progression on how to get there. However for a person to progress in the program they need to drop their ego upon starting it, realize that they have a great deal to learn, put in a large amount of work into the program, and from then on only use PMTS moves in your skiing, and while on the mountain carry out structured drills and focus on these movements in your free skiing. I do not own Lito videos, but the condo we stayed at in Killington had copies to watch when there this December, Lito had some good ideas in the video but still did not ski using PMTS moves, the best skier in the video was Harald. I did pick up a key point common to both systems, that I had be working on is transfer balance to the LTE at the end of the turn, and balance on the stance ski.