I saw this post on Epic. Paul Lorenz from Australlia

[h.harb]

Thanks guys, the quest continues, as long as I'm physically able I 'll train workout and continue to evolve my skiing. And when I can't, I guess I'll write about how it's done. I'm not done learning more about my skiing or skiing in general.

[Basil j]

One thing I noticed right away from watching your turns compared to Pauls, is although 'Paul looks very athletic and his skiing is quite energized, it appears to my (untrained) eye that he hits his edges much later in the turn than you, thus creating a launch between some of his turns' and he looks like he is very blocked"" with little or minimal upper body movement on his short turns. Looks like he could lose control easily. Like you mentioned, almost like a "bump skier You and Dianna appear to get on edge much earlier in the turn, and your upper body stay in the fall line yet it looks so much more relaxed. I would imagine that Paul would have to stay in great shape to ski like this all the time," and it could be fatiguing, where as your technique looks energized as well if not more so in some footage, but yet much more relaxed and efficient. I almost never see you off balance or "fighting"" your gear. I think Paul looks like a great skier, and probably is, yet it looks like it is a lot of work to ski like that. I love your approach of being patient and letting the gear do the work. makes great sense.

[h.harb]

Thank you, vey insightful, to the point and excellent MA.

[go_large_or_go_home]

Basil J,
I feel your pain... I am I the exact situation and it breaks my heart....but have confidence that if 'you' change your skiing your kids will follow. Caveat, you have to be on your game because your kids will rapidly catch you up....

Harald,
I am a complete convert. Your style is efficient, graceful and effortless. Already your methodology has made massive gains.. However, I have to ask.....have you always skied like this? Or is this a system/ style derived from years of experience and, dare i say it, maturity? Is there anybody else - apart from Hirscher (who, although is brilliant is not a pmts skier) that your rate?
To use a tennis analogy - roger federer is the master.. Nobody else plays like him, apart from maybe Pete Sampras...Rafael Nadal, Andy Murray, Novak djokovic all have similar styles...aggressive and attritional...i dont like their game, but they are brilliant nonetheless. It's definitely a case of waiting for their bodies to give in, whereas federer looks like he can go forever.....my question is, will they adapt their game as their bodies change/ get Older? Will they become more like Federer?

The likes of Paul Lorenz, Hisaya Sato and all the Korean demo skiers are all pretty amazing - arguably, all in the top percentile of skiers...I aspire to ski the bumps like Alex Bilodeau/ Jonny Mosely - fully in the knowledge that it is a technique exclusive to the moguls...I am getting closer now that I have embraced that premise....I also want to ski backcountry like Seth Morrison..Rip a slalom course like Hirscher AND I also want your all mountain style/ grace - you are the Federer of skiing...pretty big wish list....

How was your skiing compared to 'theirs' at an equivalent stage? Trying to MA these guys is driving me nuts....its like trying to pick apart Rafael nadals game....maybe that's the key? Who else in the 'free-skiing' arena has got it going on?

[geoffda]

Expert 2 just arrived today and My kids and I watched the whole video. Great stuff. they are already challenging some of the things they see in the video like a narrow stance, leading with inside foot calm hands and counter rotating. I love the scenario where you are outside leaning against the wall. My kids thought it looked silly, and then I actually made them put on their boots and do it themselves and they both immediately thought that it felt "right especially within the context of what they had been watching in the video so far and in relation to the slant board training they started this week. I have them do the board on both sides for 5 minutes every other day while I am riding the bike. Harald, your skiing is smooth, elegant and a joy to watch as is the women's in the video as well. I'll watch the video a few more times then crack open the book. Can't wait for the snow to fly.

If you like Expert 2, you should get the Free Skiing video to see how far he has taken his skiing since that was made (which is amazing considering what he was doing back then). Essentials Series is also well worth the cost.

[Matt]

If you like Expert 2, you should get the Free Skiing video to see how far he has taken his skiing since that was made (which is amazing considering what he was doing back then). Essentials Series is also well worth the cost.

Thanks for reminding me, time for some Bluegrass music

[Basil j]

Expert 2 just arrived today and My kids and I watched the whole video. Great stuff. they are already challenging some of the things they see in the video like a narrow stance, leading with inside foot calm hands and counter rotating. I love the scenario where you are outside leaning against the wall. My kids thought it looked silly, and then I actually made them put on their boots and do it themselves and they both immediately thought that it felt "right especially within the context of what they had been watching in the video so far and in relation to the slant board training they started this week. I have them do the board on both sides for 5 minutes every other day while I am riding the bike. Harald, your skiing is smooth, elegant and a joy to watch as is the women's in the video as well. I'll watch the video a few more times then crack open the book. Can't wait for the snow to fly.

If you like Expert 2, you should get the Free Skiing video to see how far he has taken his skiing since that was made (which is amazing considering what he was doing back then). Essentials Series is also well worth the cost.

Most Likely I will have the whole collection sooner than later.#2 gives me plenty to work on. The terminology is clear and to the point and the examples are easy to understand. If I can get my kids to stop stepping onto their new skis and incorporate the Phantom turn, get onto their turns nice & early, pull the inside leg back, keep a strong hand position,Counter action and star getting comfortable on all 4 edges with releasing, I will be thrilled. I think these are important areas to master and should be attainable for everyone in my family, and my kids will be ahead in their groups. My wife thinks I am nuts watching ski videos in September:)

[Max_501]

Most Likely I will have the whole collection sooner than later.#2 gives me plenty to work on.

Did you already work through book 1? If not you have jumped too far ahead.

[Basil j]

Most Likely I will have the whole collection sooner than later.#2 gives me plenty to work on.

Did you already work through book 1? If not you have jumped too far ahead.

I read through the whole book and watched the video twice. I will work on everything in the chronological order as presented in the book & CD

[Max_501]

I will work on everything in the chronological order as presented in the book & CD

Perfect. I always suggest starting with Book 1. Its easy to miss important foundation material if you jump into book 2.

From an older post:

Start with Book 1. Once you have it mastered move to Book 2. Essentials can be read for extra drills and instruction in conjunction with or after reading Book 2.

[h.harb]

Harald,
I am a complete convert. Your style is efficient, graceful and effortless. Already your methodology has made massive gains.. However, I have to ask.....have you always skied like this? Or is this a system/ style derived from years of experience and, dare i say it, maturity? Is there anybody else - apart from Hirscher (who, although is brilliant is not a pmts skier) that your rate?
To use a tennis analogy - roger federer is the master..

I've never been asked that question before. My skiing evolved on it's own, as a kid and teenager. I always watched other skiers even as a boy, I picked the ones I wanted to ski like and tried to copy them. There was no coaching worth listening to in those days. Once I was on the Alberta Team and was invited to ski with some of the best skiers in Canada, my eyes were opened further. At that time we didn't have male World Cup winners, but we did have three guys who were consistently top 10, even top 5 runs.

In those days we never saw ourselves ski so. (no video) I had no idea about my technique or the way I skied. I knew I was one of the fastest slalom skiers and often had fast GS runs but I didn't know my methods or even which movements were right or wrong. So in a nut shell I relied on my body and my senses.

I remember at one Nor Am race at Stowe Vermont, I was 4th or 5th after the first run, one of my team mates from the Irwin family, made a comment to me, something along these lines. "How do you go so fast by skiing so round?"
I thought at the time, it was an insult. I was always trying to go straighter. We all thought if you went straighter and closer to the pole, you would be faster. Later when I began coaching I started to understand what was needed and we also had video by then.

I watched Stenmark, everyone did, and Gunther Mader, I skied with Stenmark, followed him down the mountain, I didn't have trouble matching his turns or shape. I don't recall when I realized it, but it was during my coaching years, that my technique was different from most skiers and even most racers. I made turns and I never hit hard on the edges. I was able even at 35 years old, without training, to jump in a race course and ski as fast as National Team guys in slalom.

This goes back to the comment, "you ski so round". Knowing what I know now, I realize that I was using movements "maybe early versions of them, that created carving. Which makes sense because even to the other racers; I looked like I was skiing a rounder line, but I was faster. Most of my teammates where skiing straighter, but also hitting harder. After my coaching years, when I skied on the demo Team and started writing my books and producing videos, my skiing changed with the equipment and I emphasized High C carving and developed the pure carving techniques. And later modified them for all levels of skiing.

Skiers can learn to ski the way I do with PMTS technique, but they will never got it with TT system approaches. So where does this carving or round turn originate or develop. I have no idea, I never intended to ski that way, I didn't even know what it was, but it seemed natural so I did it. Even when I tried to ski straight at the gates and turn or get on the edges, as late as possible, I was still rounder than any one else. It must have to do with my flexibility, natural alignment and the ski's feedback.

So, as far as I know that's how I ended up skiing the way I do. Of course upon realizing what I was doing, I studied and enhanced it because I liked it. It makes sense and it makes skiing easier on the body and legs.

[h.harb]

Some foot notes and breakthroughs:

Equipment had a lot to do with my progress. Until I was 17, I had relatively soft boots, and poor skis. We couldn't afford the best, new equipment, so I got hand me downs and used skis. I worked my way up the system in the Laurentians, north of Montreal, it's a hot bed for skiing, lots of population and many small ski areas. The racing scene is very intense. I worked my way up from Class C, to class A, which was the top and made you eligible for FIS races.
I was competitive at all the different levels, placing top 3 in the big races, which included kids from other provinces. I was always frustrated, we raced on many of the same courses as the top "A" skiers, some of these A skiers were very close to the National Team level. I'd compare my times to theirs, even in my first year racing at 16. I was 5 seconds out and it was very frustrating. I struggled on ice, with my equipment. And I mean ice like you have never seen. This is at Mt Tremblant, I often ran with bib numbers over 100. Once even had the number 153, I still remember it. The course was polished ice, with chatters when I skied. It felt horrendous, I hated skidding, but I could't do anything about it. It probably didn't look as bad as it felt, but it was horrible.

When I was 17, I bought a new pair of "Trapper Elite Pro", racing boots, the same boots as Jean Claude Killy used. I moved by myself to Alberta and started racing there. In my first race I beat numerous "C" National development Team guys. The boots gave me a huge boost up. Near the end of that season, I was invited by the National Team to race two world cup races and Killy raced in one of the slaloms. It was a huge thrill, I was 18 and raced my first world cups, big year. Placed 55th in slalom. There were 80 racers.
http://www.alpinecanada.org/alpine/alpine-alumni

[Basil j]

My balance improved dramatically when I moved from Lange boots to Alpina race boots. (120 flex really isn't a race flex, but thats besides the point) I Always get a custom foam Strolz liner and footbed. Great race boots that are affordable and work well for me as a daily go to boot.

[h.harb]

The question also asked who are my favorite skiers of all time. Well first, I have a favorite tennis player of all time, I'd like to answer that first because tennis was very important to me as I grew up, it was my second sport and I really studied tennis as much as skiing. I worked for John Newcombe from 1978 to 1983. I played with many of the top NCAA college players at time and hit with Newcombe. But John was not my favorite player. My favorite was and still is, Rod Laver. I have met Laver and Ken Rosewall, Laver was way ahead of his time, he would have been a Nadal type player with modern rackets and strings.

Just as Stenmark was the best and I did get to ski with him, yet he's not my favorite. Gunter Mader and Tomba are my favorites. Mader was always a World Cup overall contender, his technique was flawless. He started as a slalom skier, in one race with start number 53 he won the race.

As far as free skiers Sato is probably my favorite. The next level is a step further down from Sato. Austrians Bernd Gruber and Richie Berger are sure great free skiers, but not my favorites. Berger has some weaknesses in free skiing, but he is really great in short turns and bumps.. In these conditions he's great, but his GS turns are weak. His slower demo skiing is also flawed. He has some alignment issues which aren't addressed and they are obvious if you watch closely. I know it's not his fault, but it hurts his skiing.

I was very impressed with an Austrian Demo Team skier in the 1970 to 80 era, his name is Lucci Schaller. I skied with him in Hintertux on some serious glacier ice back in 19777 and 78. I had just switched ski companies and was skiing on Yamaha skis. Probably one of the greatest skis I've ever skied on. Later Schaller became Austrian Kids Development team coach. I often spoke with him about kids development and his philosophy of skiing. He was a hero in Japan. He was invited there often to train their top skiers and do clinics around the country. Modern Japanese skiing is based on his teaching and skiing. Unfortunately he died in an accident, he was hit by a car while riding his bike.

My honorable mention list would include: Jean Noel Augert, Alfred Matt, and Hirscher of course. As far as modern tennis players, Nadal.

[Basil j]

I am also a big tennis guy, took it up at 37 years old after a life of pretty good level hockey and immediately fell in love with the sport.I liked Sampras for his ability to make his opponents uncomfortable, keep the pressure on, his athleticism and of course his serve. My Current favorite players have to be Federer, Haas and Nadal. All beautiful to watch for different reasons. I met Laver at the 2001 US open. Classy guy.
I also took to skiing late in life(30) and My favorites have to be:
1.Marc Giaradelli from Luxenberg- He was a one man team. Graceful yet powerful skier.
2.Mike von Grunegan (hope i spelled that right)- Smooth almost effortless speed and grace. He never looked like he was working as hard to get down the hill yet he was always fast!
3 Scott Schmitt and Trevor Peterson- Opened up the world of extreme skiing to me . They both looked technically very sound.
4. Herman Maiier-Hungriest world cup racer I ever saw. he in my opnion was the first world cupper that really exploited the advantages of shaped skis early on. He skied very aggressively, on all 4 edges better than most in that era.