Atomic Redster boot information

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Atomic Redster boot information

Postby GThomas » Tue Jan 02, 2018 1:00 am

like all keen skiers i have been working hard to find the right or best ski boot for me.
I have basicaly looked at each race boot i can find for reasons of fit as pretty much any non race boot is too large in the back end and frequently has to much height over the instep.
I am in the UK with no chance to go to Colorado although it is on my friends bucket list to do that so maybe one day.
The two recommended to me boots from one of the two best shops i know of in the UK are the Atomic Redster WC, and the Head Raptor.
I have the WC in both a 130 and 150, and the Raptor RS 130. Both boots are the best I have managed to find to date for me, although a Lange RPZB is a possible consideration.
The Raptor is too large for me in the heel and ankle areas and I believe I would have had a better starting point with the B2 or B3.
Also compared to the Redster the lateral balance in terms of inversion and eversion of the ankle in the Raptor seems to me to be less balanced.
I note the lateral inclination of the shell according to Heads own information is 1.5 deg on the Raptor RS but only .5 deg on the B series boots.
I understand that HH has issues with Atomics, and I would appreciate any input which might help me to understand what if any difficulties are seen with this particular series of boots ( mine are 2014 versions) as the fit and skiing in them is the best ive found so far, but possibly the best off the shelf fit is the Raptor which seems to match my foot well.
Note the Redsters have needed a little grinding for the navicular and sixth toe, the Raptors would need pehaps a little grinding for the fifth metatarsal and if anything may still be a little large in the heel cup than ideal.
Also note I tried a pro tongue in the Raptor RS trying to take up ankle space and this was insufficient and resorted to a zip fit liner with a lot of extra cork trying to get the fit snug enough.
Before i buy a Raptor B2 I would like to understand as much as possible the reason the Atomics I have are maybe not ideal and what benefits I might derive from the B2 and how apart from snugger fit they differ from the Raptor RS 130 boots I already have
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Re: Atomic Redster boot information

Postby Jeet » Tue Jan 02, 2018 2:56 am

Are the two shops in the UK Ski Bartlet and Solutions for Feet?
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Re: Atomic Redster boot information

Postby GThomas » Tue Jan 02, 2018 4:58 am

Hi Jeet,
Colin did me a pair of boots while still at Lockwoods, so i know how focused etc he can be and would be confident in him and his work.
i went to Bartlets to try the Raptors to see how they fitted. Sally said yes she would put me into either the Raptor or the Redster. She was I think of the opinion that the WC 130 would be the best choice. The pressure over the navicular and sixth toe concerned me. So i tried the Pro, vesion but bought from them the B3's
Later at home i decided the safer bet would be for me to not over match myself so changed them to the Raptor RS130's that i have.
I got the chance to buy at massive discount £87 to my door from USA a pair of 2014 Redster WC 150 boots so bought these both because i wanted to see what a very much stiffer boot is like and to cover the fact Sally thought the WC130 would be a good choice.
I liked the WC150 a lot except for getting the bear trap off my foot when cold and was getting calluses on two pressure points but did not want them worked on until sure about foot changes and foot beds etc.
I bought last year again from Bartlets a pair of Redster WC130 also (2014) to get the same fit in an easier on/off package and because I wanted a second pair in case this boot was changed or discontinued, which it now is
The 130's ive had the pressure points ground and a foam liner done at the APC in Austria and is the boot i concluded is the best ive had so far. This is allowing me to modify the one bootwhile leaving the 150's untouched
It seems to me the Raptors i have i am hard against the medial wall restricting pronation so im working from up the chain well as being too spacious on the lateral side
I have a pair of Lange 120 SC and while these are the wrong boot being too soft they felt the most balanced in terms of allowing use of my ankle
Colin suggested a friend of his who works at Brundle in Kaprun as a good choice if we need boot work ( he is as well as being a really nice guy ) and thinks a Lange RPZB would work.
For now I have a good bench mark and usable boots or at least they were last year and I am trying to learn more about all aspects of this so any further choices are giving me a further step forward in terms of my skiing
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Re: Atomic Redster boot information

Postby Robert0325 » Tue Jan 02, 2018 6:41 am

How do you propose sorting out alignment? In my experience that’s more the issue as all the boot fitters in the UK (including Solutions4feet that are probably the best) use the hard cork foot beds that are not recommended for PMTS as they tend to over lock your feet. That of course is just the tip of the ice burg if you need more extensive alignment procedures as the UK boot fitters don’t do alignment the PMTS way..
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Re: Atomic Redster boot information

Postby nipper » Tue Jan 02, 2018 7:50 am

Some years ago I had boots fitted at Solutions and I was very happy with the fit. However when I mentioned pmts he dismissed it as rubbish and said that he had recently had to completely readjust the alignment of a clients boots that had been set up on a pmts camp. How on earth he could carry out a better alignment in shop compared to the static and on snow alignment at a pmts camp is beyond me. Later I had my boots "balanced" whereby rubber shims were placed inside the boot. I later found out at camp that this gives a totally different result to cants fitted to the soles of the boots. I think that for us uk skiers the only place to go for proper alignment is to enrol for a Hintertux camp. You will just not get the required expertise anywhere else.
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Re: Atomic Redster boot information

Postby Robert0325 » Tue Jan 02, 2018 9:20 am

nipper wrote:Some years ago I had boots fitted at Solutions and I was very happy with the fit. However when I mentioned pmts he dismissed it as rubbish and said that he had recently had to completely readjust the alignment of a clients boots that had been set up on a pmts camp. How on earth he could carry out a better alignment in shop compared to the static and on snow alignment at a pmts camp is beyond me. Later I had my boots "balanced" whereby rubber shims were placed inside the boot. I later found out at camp that this gives a totally different result to cants fitted to the soles of the boots. I think that for us uk skiers the only place to go for proper alignment is to enrol for a Hintertux camp. You will just not get the required expertise anywhere else.


If you cant wait or afford the Hintertux camp, I'd recommend going to Portes du Ski in Holland as they do alignment and footbeds the PMTS way. I was very pleased with what they did for me.
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Re: Atomic Redster boot information

Postby GThomas » Tue Jan 02, 2018 11:34 am

i did not wish to get into past history regarding foot beds. I over pronate etc. While at Lockwoods Colin did a non weight bearing cork footbed and was upset it had to go into the bin, there is a lot more I could say but it helps nothing and this was all a long time ago. The shell work and foam liner he did I was happy with and i expect he has learnt a lot since then.
As for alignment Im now 62 and ive learnt a ton in the last two years as ive had the chance to ski more and apply my mind to it in a more serious way. I know what I am looking for in a foot bed have made my own or modified others with the aid of the Alignment manual and some helpful advise from Diana, and my own are the best ive used as opposed to a very expensive American podiatrist i was recommended to who when the full carbon foot bed became uncomfortable chose an illogical remedy which i told him so it was illogical and would not work but he went ahead and they went from uncomfortable to unwearable, so like most skiers i imagine the past is littered with poor foot beds.
I leave in the morning for five weeks in Austria, and will use the boots I have and will be doing a little playing around due to physical changes ive made since last year.
I can not afford the Hintertux camp but anyway right now I am trying to learn more about the different boots and why some are thought to be problematic or one boot may suit one person and not another.
I shall be asking some questions as to what is offerred in the way of alignment but but in essence i think the best I can do is sort out a footbed and boot which best allows me to work from my feet up maximising my ability to balance on one foot at a time and which feels to me balance in terms of supination and pronation.
I have read on here as to how correct alignment can transform a persons skiing but as yet i dont have the chance to even to begin to look into this not until I find I have access to a route I trust
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Re: Atomic Redster boot information

Postby Obrules15 » Tue Jan 02, 2018 7:22 pm

GThomas wrote:i did not wish to get into past history regarding foot beds. I over pronate etc. While at Lockwoods Colin did a non weight bearing cork footbed and was upset it had to go into the bin, there is a lot more I could say but it helps nothing and this was all a long time ago. The shell work and foam liner he did I was happy with and i expect he has learnt a lot since then.
As for alignment Im now 62 and ive learnt a ton in the last two years as ive had the chance to ski more and apply my mind to it in a more serious way. I know what I am looking for in a foot bed have made my own or modified others with the aid of the Alignment manual and some helpful advise from Diana, and my own are the best ive used as opposed to a very expensive American podiatrist i was recommended to who when the full carbon foot bed became uncomfortable chose an illogical remedy which i told him so it was illogical and would not work but he went ahead and they went from uncomfortable to unwearable, so like most skiers i imagine the past is littered with poor foot beds.
I leave in the morning for five weeks in Austria, and will use the boots I have and will be doing a little playing around due to physical changes ive made since last year.
I can not afford the Hintertux camp but anyway right now I am trying to learn more about the different boots and why some are thought to be problematic or one boot may suit one person and not another.
I shall be asking some questions as to what is offerred in the way of alignment but but in essence i think the best I can do is sort out a footbed and boot which best allows me to work from my feet up maximising my ability to balance on one foot at a time and which feels to me balance in terms of supination and pronation.
I have read on here as to how correct alignment can transform a persons skiing but as yet i dont have the chance to even to begin to look into this not until I find I have access to a route I trust


If I recall correctly, Harald said that the Atomic boots had a setup where the foot was slightly inverted due to the shape of the liner, which screwed with the lower leg geometry enough to significantly impact the alignment process.
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Re: Atomic Redster boot information

Postby Jeet » Wed Jan 03, 2018 3:03 am

Guys,

I skii at the indoor snow centre. I have seen Collins work on about 7 racers and 2 recreational skiiers. It's not even close to what HSS achieves.

Two Hintertux campers visited the Snow Centre, I saw them skii before I knew who they were. I was amazed with their alignment, I was thinking "This is got to be a job done by HSS". I approached him and her said do you know "Harald Harb" he smiled and we shook hands and yes HSS did the alignment. We spent the next hour or two skiing together.

Such a great feeling when you bump into fellow PMTS skiers.

Jeet
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Re: Atomic Redster boot information

Postby GThomas » Wed Jan 03, 2018 11:00 am

Obrules15 wrote:
If I recall correctly, Harald said that the Atomic boots had a setup where the foot was slightly inverted due to the shape of the liner, which screwed with the lower leg geometry enough to significantly impact the alignment process.


Thanks this is the kind of information I was looking for.
I don't think it is the liner but the clog has a shape which would I imagine fit some feet probably those with great skiing feet and for me the only way to not have pressure on the navicular and 6th toe areas was to place it in a way which indeed felt inverted.
This is why after my first five weeks I had calluses develop there and stopped using them while. Decided what to do but this was happening while I was still able to pronate due to having fairly flexible and thin feet
Having had those two areas ground the foot can sit comfortably and naturally without issues I'm happy to say

Also thank you Jeet for your posts this is information which supports my own instinct to not try that route
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Re: Atomic Redster boot information

Postby Obrules15 » Wed Jan 03, 2018 11:26 am

GThomas wrote:
Obrules15 wrote:
If I recall correctly, Harald said that the Atomic boots had a setup where the foot was slightly inverted due to the shape of the liner, which screwed with the lower leg geometry enough to significantly impact the alignment process.


Thanks this is the kind of information I was looking for.
I don't think it is the liner but the clog has a shape which would I imagine fit some feet probably those with great skiing feet and for me the only way to not have pressure on the navicular and 6th toe areas was to place it in a way which indeed felt inverted.
This is why after my first five weeks I had calluses develop there and stopped using them while. Decided what to do but this was happening while I was still able to pronate due to having fairly flexible and thin feet
Having had those two areas ground the foot can sit comfortably and naturally without issues I'm happy to say

Also thank you Jeet for your posts this is information which supports my own instinct to not try that route


It being the clog makes more sense as I remember talking about the difficulty with alignment on that boot which wouldn't be an issue if it was only the liner (Duh :oops: ). Good Luck!
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