Liners: Zipfits / Foam / Intuition Pro Tongue

Post your questions/comments about Gear here

Liners: Zipfits / Foam / Intuition Pro Tongue

Postby Jeet » Fri May 05, 2017 3:03 am

Hi Guys,

I am in the market for new liners. My stock liners that came with HEAD Raptor RS 140 have started to pack out. I live in the UK so there are only a few shops in the country have the competence and skill to fit a liner properly. Talking to some of these boot fitters they are recommending Zip Fits rather Pro Tongue. Is anyone using the Zip Fits (Gara) for example, are they worth getting or should I stay away from these liners.

Most boot fitter are telling me the Pro Tongue is going to be too tight for me?
User avatar
Jeet
 
Posts: 159
Joined: Fri Jul 18, 2014 3:09 am

Re: Liners: Zipfits / Foam / Intuition Pro Tongue

Postby ChrisC » Fri May 05, 2017 3:55 am

I've used Zip Fit liners and found them to be good. I think I had the Grand Prix model which suited my feet (wide forefoot, but narrow heel). There are different models with different amounts of the cork based material for other foot and ankle shapes.

They are very easy to fit - basically just heat up and wear - this can be done as many times as necessary.

I'm now using the stock liners in my Lange RS 140s, which also have a cork based material.

I haven't used Intuition liners, but I'm thinking of getting some next time I'm in the US because they are warmer and my feet get cold with the cork based liners. I'd choose the Race FX for my feet.
ChrisC
 
Posts: 29
Joined: Thu Sep 11, 2014 5:41 pm

Re: Liners: Zipfits / Foam / Intuition Pro Tongue

Postby DougD » Fri May 05, 2017 11:00 am

Did you ask why these local fitters prefer Zip Fits to Intuition Pro Tongues? Is their preference based on experience with both products and carefully documented fitting/alignment work on thousands of skiers? Can they explain this preference in a way that demostrates they know what they're talking about? Most USA shops don't understand fitting/alignment and one doesn't imagine UK fitters being any better, on average.

FWIW, HSS sells and fits the Intuition Pro Tongue. I got a great fit on the first try. Major improvement in tipping control and responsiveness vs. my stock Lange (RX 130) liners. They're also warmer, firmer and will certainly last much longer before packing out.

The Pro Tongues are highly regarded by many serious PMTS skiers. Search this forum for other takes than mine. They may or may not be the best liners for your individual feet and legs, but I'd question any fitter who dismissed them blithely or generically.
DougD
 
Posts: 572
Joined: Thu Apr 10, 2014 6:22 am
Location: Connecticut, USA

Re: Liners: Zipfits / Foam / Intuition Pro Tongue

Postby jbotti » Fri May 05, 2017 1:53 pm

Diana has some respect for the Zipfits and they have some success with them with certain skiers. But HH and Diana both ski the Pro Tongues and they both think its the best liner they have ever skied. Do you need more than that to make your decision?
Balance: Essential in skiing and in life!
User avatar
jbotti
 
Posts: 2184
Joined: Fri Nov 28, 2003 10:05 am

Re: Liners: Zipfits / Foam / Intuition Pro Tongue

Postby ToddW » Fri May 05, 2017 3:49 pm

Jeet,

For Raptors, go with the Pro Tongue liner unless you have highly pressure-sensitive feet. Don't consider anything else if you have hot spots around the fifth metatarsal head (the bulge behind your pinky toe.)

Zipfits snug up the heel and ankle, and they do this decently. However, the forefoot gets no support and the Zipfit liner there is basically a piece of neoprene. In contrast, the Pro Tongue molds to and supports the whole calf, the ankle, and both forefoot and hindfoot. This means you'll get stronger and faster response to your tipping movements.

The main weakness with the Pro Tongue is shared by the Zipfit. The tongue is a bit soft (compared the old Nordica foam liners that HSS used to sell) and can concentrate pressure on one spot on the shin. If you encounter discomfort from this, a work around is to use two booster straps to spread the load out. If the tongue on the Intuition is too close or too far from your shin, it can be amputated and reattached with elastic so it floats to adjust (if you go in "racer style".)
.
ToddW
 
Posts: 511
Joined: Sat Feb 03, 2007 8:41 pm
Location: live: Westchester (NY) / ski: Killington

Re: Liners: Zipfits / Foam / Intuition Pro Tongue

Postby Jeet » Wed May 10, 2017 4:00 am

Hi Guys,

Thank you for your reviews and guidance. I will have to import the Pro tongue as no is selling them in Europe or UK.

Jeet
User avatar
Jeet
 
Posts: 159
Joined: Fri Jul 18, 2014 3:09 am

Re: Liners: Zipfits / Foam / Intuition Pro Tongue

Postby Robert0325 » Wed May 10, 2017 8:59 am

Just a thought Jeet, but have you tried Portes Du Ski in Holland?
Robert0325
 
Posts: 139
Joined: Sat Aug 10, 2013 7:45 am
Location: England, UK

Re: Liners: Zipfits / Foam / Intuition Pro Tongue

Postby Jeet » Thu May 11, 2017 1:32 am

Good idea, I will get in contact with them.

Jeet
User avatar
Jeet
 
Posts: 159
Joined: Fri Jul 18, 2014 3:09 am

Re: Liners: Zipfits / Foam / Intuition Pro Tongue

Postby Marc » Thu May 11, 2017 4:33 am

Try http://www.shokmode.net. I bought my Pro Tongues from a related site a few years ago. There is also a UK located dealer on eBay selling Intuition liners.

Good to have a convection oven to do the baking/thermo forming
Marc
 
Posts: 92
Joined: Tue Sep 18, 2012 2:29 pm

Re: Liners: Zipfits / Foam / Intuition Pro Tongue

Postby Robert0325 » Fri May 12, 2017 5:24 am

Jeet, won't you have to have your alignment redone after fitting the new liners?
Robert0325
 
Posts: 139
Joined: Sat Aug 10, 2013 7:45 am
Location: England, UK

Re: Liners: Zipfits / Foam / Intuition Pro Tongue

Postby Jeet » Fri May 12, 2017 6:22 am

Thanks Marc, good information.

Robert, good point and this was something I was thinking about. I got the alignment done on the stock liner when it was fresh and new, hopefully when I get the new liners in there will not be much alignment issues, I will have to take a video but I can't imagine that it will be out too much? Hopefully, something I can sort out with a credit card or two.

I would of thought the alignment changes as the stock liners pack out anyway? So it possible I am out of alignment now, with packed out liners?

Jeet
User avatar
Jeet
 
Posts: 159
Joined: Fri Jul 18, 2014 3:09 am

Re: Liners: Zipfits / Foam / Intuition Pro Tongue

Postby DougD » Fri May 12, 2017 7:04 am

Robert0325 wrote:Jeet, won't you have to have your alignment redone after fitting the new liners?


Jeet wrote:Robert, good point and this was something I was thinking about. I got the alignment done on the stock liner when it was fresh and new, hopefully when I get the new liners in there will not be much alignment issues, I will have to take a video but I can't imagine that it will be out too much? Hopefully, something I can sort out with a credit card or two.

I would of thought the alignment changes as the stock liners pack out anyway? So it possible I am out of alignment now, with packed out liners?


Alignment depends more on the footbed than on the boot liner. I assume your alignment adjustments were preceded by a thorough functional assessment of your foot support needs and custom footbeds if indicated. (If it didn't, it wasn't done properly). If so, moving your footbeds into the new liners should carry most of your alignment setup with them. You may need a minor alignment tweak but it shouldn't be a major rework. FWIW, in my case an on-snow evaluation by two Black level coaches over several days resulted in a mere 1/4 degree tweak to each boot vs. the shop setup. Helpful, but not a major change.
DougD
 
Posts: 572
Joined: Thu Apr 10, 2014 6:22 am
Location: Connecticut, USA

Re: Liners: Zipfits / Foam / Intuition Pro Tongue

Postby Jeet » Fri May 12, 2017 7:13 am

Doug my alignment was done at the Hintetux Camp by Diana, she also made my footbeds :)

That's good news about the minor change in alignment. I think Alain Baxter may have the pro tongue intuition liner in the UK, he lives in Scotland, he said he will ship it to me if can get hold of it, if not I will order it from the website Marc mentioned in his post.

I will go to a very good fitter to get the liners done (ProFeet in London), I am glad I am not asking for alignment work or footbeds, I am confident they will do a decent job on the liner.

Jeet
User avatar
Jeet
 
Posts: 159
Joined: Fri Jul 18, 2014 3:09 am

Re: Liners: Zipfits / Foam / Intuition Pro Tongue

Postby Obrules15 » Fri May 12, 2017 10:01 am

ToddW wrote:Jeet,

For Raptors, go with the Pro Tongue liner unless you have highly pressure-sensitive feet. Don't consider anything else if you have hot spots around the fifth metatarsal head (the bulge behind your pinky toe.)

Zipfits snug up the heel and ankle, and they do this decently. However, the forefoot gets no support and the Zipfit liner there is basically a piece of neoprene. In contrast, the Pro Tongue molds to and supports the whole calf, the ankle, and both forefoot and hindfoot. This means you'll get stronger and faster response to your tipping movements.

The main weakness with the Pro Tongue is shared by the Zipfit. The tongue is a bit soft (compared the old Nordica foam liners that HSS used to sell) and can concentrate pressure on one spot on the shin. If you encounter discomfort from this, a work around is to use two booster straps to spread the load out. If the tongue on the Intuition is too close or too far from your shin, it can be amputated and reattached with elastic so it floats to adjust (if you go in "racer style".)



Todd, how would you determine if the tongue on the Intuition is too far forward & would benefit from elastic. I spend a fair amount of energy snugging in that tongue to pull it closer (I have narrow ankles), and don't quite feel like it's close enough despite some fancy tying at the ankles. I don't think it negatively affects my skiing (what negatively affects my skiing are my skills and weak ankles) or causes a great deal of discomfort. On the other hand I'm on my fourth or fifth variation on methods of tying up my liners to improve fit, so.........

Also, if I did try this modification is elastic necessary, or could lycra/spandex work just as well (I'd prefer to avoid adding bulk over my instep).
Obrules15
 
Posts: 101
Joined: Tue May 10, 2016 4:46 pm

Re: Liners: Zipfits / Foam / Intuition Pro Tongue

Postby skiffie » Wed May 17, 2017 12:22 pm

Just to note, HSS put me in Zipfits over Intuitions because I have a super low volume foot. :)
skiffie
 
Posts: 67
Joined: Thu Mar 05, 2015 1:44 pm

Next

Return to Gear

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 11 guests