Short Turn MA

Short Turn MA

Postby jepoupatout » Sat Mar 02, 2013 8:09 pm

All comments appreciated, short turn in steep pitch. I had a lot of fun doing those turns, the temperature was great +3 Celcius.




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Re: Short Turn MA

Postby Matt » Sat Mar 02, 2013 11:46 pm

Looks like you have a slight extension before transition.
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Re: Short Turn MA

Postby jepoupatout » Sun Mar 03, 2013 2:33 am

Is the stance width appropriate for the size of the skier? I think yes
Does the release start by flexing the outside leg? Yes
Does LTE tipping lead engagement to the new turn? No, I have a big challenge here
Are the feet pulled back at transition? Yes
Is the inside foot held back throughout the turn? Yes
Is there enough CB and CA and is the timing right? CB and CA is weak when turn to the right .
Is the pelvis included in the CB/CA movement? Yes
Strong inside arm? No
Is the inside leg flexed as the turn progresses? Yes
Does the outside leg extend naturally (no pushing) as the turn progresses? Yes.
Does LTE tipping of the inside foot continue throughout the turn? Yes
Is the skier balanced over the outside ski? Yes
Is there a pole touch and how is the movement and timing? Yes and timing right
Alignment - watch the skis and knees carefully - does anything look like it needs go be tipped in or out? Good question, I think I have alignment issue if not technical issue
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Re: Short Turn MA

Postby MonsterMan » Sun Mar 03, 2013 3:55 am

Nice turns Jupoopitoot

In Video 2, is that your wife gasping?


It sounds familiar.












:-)
"Someone once said to me that for us to beat the Europeans at winter sports was like Austria tackling us at Test cricket. I reckon it's an accurate judgement." Malcolm Milne
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Re: Short Turn MA

Postby jepoupatout » Sun Mar 03, 2013 5:23 am

Monsterman, yes it was, watch that other video and she will say in french after the focus on my boots, Christian, it doesn't work, she had a lot of diffculty to capture a good video from the back.
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Re: Short Turn MA

Postby HighAngles » Sun Mar 03, 2013 5:31 am

jepoupatout wrote:Does the release start by flexing the outside leg? Yes


I do not believe this is true. I think that you should work on really exaggerating your flex to release to see if it's actually part of your movement pattern. It looks like there's an extension happening to achieve release, but it's not quite as extended as some skiers that clearly use extension to release.

After re-watching the videos again it's now more obvious to me that you are TALL at the transition and SHORT at the apex of the turns. That's entirely opposite of what a PMTS turn should look like.
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Re: Short Turn MA

Postby jclayton » Sun Mar 03, 2013 6:28 am

I think I agree with HIgh Angles , also I see a push of the heels instead of an edge change while still flexed .

I also see a curve fo the spine instead of level hips in many turns .
skinut ,among other things
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Re: Short Turn MA

Postby milesb » Sun Mar 03, 2013 10:40 am

Pushing off the uphill ski. This is common in short high energy turns. Concentrate on keeping the uphill leg flexed as you release and tip the downhill ski to the LTE, and keep it flexed for a bit to give the new stance ski a chance to engage early. That will make these turns even more fun!
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Re: Short Turn MA

Postby HighAngles » Sun Mar 03, 2013 7:20 pm

I think I've requested previously that you post some medium radius more GS style turns. I think then it would become clearer what path you should follow to improve your PMTS movements.
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Re: Short Turn MA

Postby serious » Mon Mar 04, 2013 3:38 pm

Yes, you do extend to release (instead of flexing to release).
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Re: Short Turn MA

Postby Max_501 » Mon Mar 04, 2013 3:44 pm

jepoupatout, can you see how you back off the front of the ski immediately after the transition? You start to flex the outside leg too early, even before the skis have hit the fall-line. Can you see how your hips are dropping towards the skis as you flex the outside leg? Many skiers do this. When you start flexing the outside leg that early you have nothing left to flex with at the end of the arc. This is why there is an extension/pop at the end of turn. First thing to work on is pulling the feet back and holding them back. My three favorite fore/aft drills are flappers, mini dolphin, and the phantom javelin. Then work on flexing the inside leg while you learn to develop a long outside leg. A good drill is the Power Release.

Note - the MA above is HH approved.

Here's something to ponder:

What makes skiers flex too soon? Are they backing away from the pressure or is it something else?
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Re: Short Turn MA

Postby h.harb » Wed Mar 06, 2013 12:12 pm

One obvious movement in addition to what Max501 put up. Watch your inside hand and pole in the video shot from behind, the last three turns. "Remember the quote:
If your inside hand and pole are not moving forward, during the arc, you are rotating!
. This is partly due to the hips dropping as Max501 wrote. Because the rotation helps the skis turn if there is not enough tip pressure. So if the tip pressure goes away, your body has to help with the turning forces.

If you look at each still frame off the videos displayed for the first post, you are in good shape, that's why we study movement, one still frame, only tells you a small part of the story.
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Re: Short Turn MA

Postby h.harb » Wed Mar 06, 2013 7:50 pm

Additional explanation added:

And here is your answer to why PSIA steering and leg rotation doesn't work in skiing. You can CA your hips when you use tipping movements, (because the is base stable ("skis") but you can't CA your hips while leg steering (that is id you are trying to hold an edge). (Leg steering creates and unstable base, and it forces the pelvis to follow the legs bringing the hips around. You can CA the hips, with pivot slips, but pivot slips are useless, because they teach and ingrain movements that have nothing to do with real skiing. These are two totally different biomechanics. Why do you think everyone in PSIA is a hip and shoulder rotator and an extender? It "stems" yes, pun intended, from their stupid idea of leg steering, which incidentally comes out of Gearge Joubert's books, which incidentally suck.

So the pivot slip was invented to show that the hips can CA. But what the PSIA doesn't get is this can only be done with the skis in skid mod. You can't get a holding edge, with leg steering unless you are ready to accept a hip and torso rotation to go with it. Look, it's hard enough for many skiers to learn CA, let alone learn CA without the base of support, "your legs" are destabilizing the base when you try to steer them.
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Re: Short Turn MA

Postby jepoupatout » Thu Mar 07, 2013 12:15 am

I've learned the PSIA way up to age 25 and even if i quit ski the next following 20 years it is still part of my background and very hard to replace. It is integrated inconsciously and come back easyly in steep pitch . I can see the hip dropping toward the outside ski, the lost of pressure on the tip of the ski and the rotation.
concerning pulling the feet back and holding them back , i always thought pulling back only one ski , the inside ski.
Dropping the hip toward the ski, i started to developp it recentely so it will be able to manage.
Killing the extension at the beginning of the turn , that one i concentrated a lot this week . I 've noticed that if i don't push and delay the extension it is easier to tip earlier and CB.
My performance dropped at the beginning ( one step back for better jumping ahead story) but i think i am in the right way.
Pushing the heel, yes that's true i noticed occasionnally and didn't take care but i will.
Pushing, steering and rotation are all attach and i think that if i can kill the extension i should improve more rapidely.
Next video , short turn the PMTS way :roll:
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Re: Short Turn MA

Postby h.harb » Fri Mar 08, 2013 3:40 pm

Make sure you differentiate between hips moving low toward the heels of both boots and hips dropping to the inside of the turn. Geoffda can tell you, he "used" to do "both".
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