Short Turns

Short Turns

Postby arothafel » Sat Dec 15, 2012 8:25 pm

The only thing I'm concentrating on is to NOT push off or extend. One of the many "holy grails."

<->
Last edited by arothafel on Sat Jan 19, 2013 6:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
arothafel
 
Posts: 637
Joined: Sun Oct 23, 2005 4:04 pm
Location: Villa Park, California

Re: Short Turns

Postby MonsterMan » Sun Dec 16, 2012 10:05 pm

Nice turns, pity the video isn't longer, nice to watch. Hands maybe reaching a bit? Right hand worse than left? I'd recommend working on the no swing pole plant now, this should help you hold counter and edges until you release on the turns to the left. It looks to me like a bit of upper body rotation from the pole reach in those few turns.

Geoff
"Someone once said to me that for us to beat the Europeans at winter sports was like Austria tackling us at Test cricket. I reckon it's an accurate judgement." Malcolm Milne
User avatar
MonsterMan
 
Posts: 911
Joined: Wed Dec 13, 2006 7:10 pm
Location: Surfers' Paradise, Australia

Re: Short Turns

Postby jepoupatout » Mon Dec 17, 2012 5:03 am

Nice turn in control, i will work on flexing to release it will help to get early tipping. Have a look at .04 second, your downhill leg still very long when you pole and your tipping is weak by default at this moment.
User avatar
jepoupatout
 
Posts: 208
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2010 9:48 am
Location: Quebec City

Re: Short Turns

Postby arothafel » Mon Dec 17, 2012 6:44 am

Yes... that dreaded pole plant and hands. You catch me every time, Geoff. Flex to release was the focus, Jepoupatout... but more, more, more...

Just for comparison.... here's a video from my second camp with HH at Mt. Hood in 2007. Check out the "up" moves, rotation, arm swing.... the whole enchilada! Then, of course, the Master demonstrates how it's to be done! Makes it look easy..!

User avatar
arothafel
 
Posts: 637
Joined: Sun Oct 23, 2005 4:04 pm
Location: Villa Park, California

Re: Short Turns

Postby geoffda » Mon Dec 17, 2012 8:15 am

arothafel wrote:Just for comparison.... here's a video from my second camp with HH at Mt. Hood in 2007. Check out the "up" moves, rotation, arm swing.... the whole enchilada![/b][/i]


Sucking less is not an excuse... Get your shit together! :mrgreen: Seriously, nice, controlled turns. You are achieving your focus of flexion and not pushing off. For the level of energy you have in those turns, your flexion is appropriate. More flexion for those turns would be contrived and unnecessary. When you start ramping up the tipping and rebound, then you would need to add more flexion. Meanwhile, I would agree with Geoff that counteracting stands out as being weak in those turns. On your right turns, your pole plant is causing you to rotate. NSPP (as Geoff suggested) would be a good focus, but before you do that, work some counteracting drills to get your hips moving.
User avatar
geoffda
 
Posts: 862
Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2009 10:42 am
Location: Copper Mountain, CO

Re: Short Turns

Postby Max_501 » Mon Dec 17, 2012 12:16 pm

The BPST requires more inside foot tipping, more inside foot pullback, MORE CA!

Maximum flex should be during the release. Your flex timing is off...a bit late which causes max flex to come later than the release. This may be a remnant of your old movements. Work on exaggerating the flex AND tipping and then hold the flex while tipping (engaging) the new turn. Avoid any intentional extension of the outside leg (just let the outside leg get long on its own as needed to maintain snow contact). Remember to pull back hard during the release and really pull/hold the inside foot back.

The NSPP would be great for your skiing. Look at your inside hand and arm. Notice how they are rotating and dropping into the turn. Take an on-snow day and hammer the CA and CB drills from Essentials.

Supplement on-snow drills with the tipping board and the carvers. IMO the tipping board is great for super charging on snow drills.
User avatar
Max_501
 
Posts: 4124
Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2005 7:39 pm

Re: Short Turns

Postby milesb » Mon Dec 17, 2012 4:38 pm

geoffda wrote:........ Seriously, nice, controlled turns. You are achieving your focus of flexion and not pushing off. For the level of energy you have in those turns, your flexion is appropriate. More flexion for those turns would be contrived and unnecessary.....


While I am not a fan of "overskiing" the turns and looking contrived, do you think it would help- for learning purposes- to exaggerrate the flexing?
Art has done a great job the last couple of times I've skied with him on flexing and brushing. That work has improved his overall skiing, as the video he posted in his "it's that time again" thread (4th video) shows.
YouTube channel https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCH78E6wIKnq3Fg0eUf2MFng
User avatar
milesb
 
Posts: 981
Joined: Sat Feb 21, 2004 10:17 am
Location: Los Angeles

Re: Short Turns

Postby geoffda » Mon Dec 17, 2012 5:54 pm

milesb wrote:
geoffda wrote:........ Seriously, nice, controlled turns. You are achieving your focus of flexion and not pushing off. For the level of energy you have in those turns, your flexion is appropriate. More flexion for those turns would be contrived and unnecessary.....


While I am not a fan of "overskiing" the turns and looking contrived, do you think it would help- for learning purposes- to exaggerrate the flexing?
Art has done a great job the last couple of times I've skied with him on flexing and brushing. That work has improved his overall skiing, as the video he posted in his "it's that time again" thread (4th video) shows.


Sure. Exaggeration of movement is a great learning tool. That said, for the turns that Art was making, the level of flexion seemed appropriate (and I'm assuming he was not trying to exaggerate). There is a little additional collapse in the top of the arc, which Max called out, but even without it, I wasn't seeing extension. You don't need much flexion at all for brushed turns. So when looking at those specific turns, I don't immediately think "work on flexion". For those specific turns, IMO the weakest visible movement was counteracting and the pole plant inducing rotation.

That said, if Art is asking "how do I turn my brushed carved turns into BPSRT?", then Max had the answer. More of everything. Art would need to tip more, flex, more, pull back more, CB more, CA more (and hold it). At that point, the question would become, what would happen if Art tried to do all of those things? What would he look like? It could very well be that if he tried to ramp it up, flexion would indeed become a problem again and exaggeration would make sense. Or it may be that he is fully capable of managing his flexion and it wouldn't be an issue.
Last edited by geoffda on Mon Dec 17, 2012 7:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
geoffda
 
Posts: 862
Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2009 10:42 am
Location: Copper Mountain, CO

Re: Short Turns

Postby milesb » Mon Dec 17, 2012 7:01 pm

Good stuff, thanks.
YouTube channel https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCH78E6wIKnq3Fg0eUf2MFng
User avatar
milesb
 
Posts: 981
Joined: Sat Feb 21, 2004 10:17 am
Location: Los Angeles

Re: Short Turns

Postby Max_501 » Mon Dec 17, 2012 9:23 pm

The flex timing is also contributing to a delay of tipping the new inside foot.
User avatar
Max_501
 
Posts: 4124
Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2005 7:39 pm

Re: Short Turns

Postby arothafel » Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:45 am

Great feedback and analysis. Thanks guys. I will HTFU and get to work!
User avatar
arothafel
 
Posts: 637
Joined: Sun Oct 23, 2005 4:04 pm
Location: Villa Park, California

Re: Short Turns

Postby arothafel » Sat Feb 16, 2013 11:15 am

Here's an update. Sort of a sequence from flat to steeper.

The focus this time was on figuring out how to tip more and pull the free foot back. My mental cue (thanks Miles) is to think of the old stance/new free foot ski tip as a "hinge" -- whereby the heel is slightly lifted, tipped, bringing the free foot boot toward the new stance boot and pulled back.

My biggest frustration is the dreaded "UP" move. I just can't seem to get rid of it. Hence "more flex!" Easy to say, but I don't seem to know how to get more flex. Every time I try to suck up and pull back my old stance foot at transition.. I end up with some kind of funky hip movement. (:38, :40) Looks like a "giddy-up" at the hips and is contrived.

Max, you mentioned earlier a "timing issue." A delay. Could you explain a little more and how I might correct? Am I coming around too much? Should the turn be released earlier? And do you think this timing is creating some sort of problem relating to my inability to flex more?

User avatar
arothafel
 
Posts: 637
Joined: Sun Oct 23, 2005 4:04 pm
Location: Villa Park, California

Re: Short Turns

Postby HighAngles » Sat Feb 16, 2013 3:27 pm

This isn't a classic up move problem. What I'm seeing is a rush to get on the new edges that is causing you to rise after the release.

Flex to release and FLEX to engage. I think that's what you need to think about. Have you ever worked on the wall drill to practice releasing and getting over to your new edges using flexing? Harald shows it in the Essentials videos. The only way to get off the wall correctly is to flex the old stance leg and keep flexing it as your hips cross over while staying level (absolutely no rise).

At Super Blue camp, Jay was saying that you should go even further when flexing to engage - you've flexed the old stance leg to release, but then flex the new inside leg (was the old stance leg) even more as you tip that ski.

So I think that's why it may have been described to you as a timing issue. The sequence of your movements needs some tweaking - they're not totally off the mark.
User avatar
HighAngles
 
Posts: 792
Joined: Sun Nov 29, 2009 5:46 am

Re: Short Turns

Postby Max_501 » Sat Feb 16, 2013 4:20 pm

When you lift your outside foot to release try to maintain the flex of the (old) inside leg. That will get rid of the up you are seeing. Work on including your hips in the CA/CB movement. CA should start as soon as the skis are in the fall line.
User avatar
Max_501
 
Posts: 4124
Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2005 7:39 pm

Re: Short Turns

Postby milesb » Sat Feb 16, 2013 4:31 pm

Max_501 wrote:When you lift your outside foot to release try to maintain the flex of the (old) inside leg. That will get rid of the up you are seeing....



lol, that's what I've been telling him. Let's see YOU get him to do that! :D

Art is actually doing exactly that through most of the video, it's not until the final sequence that he extends into the turn. I saw some great TFRs.
YouTube channel https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCH78E6wIKnq3Fg0eUf2MFng
User avatar
milesb
 
Posts: 981
Joined: Sat Feb 21, 2004 10:17 am
Location: Los Angeles

Next

Return to Movement Analysis and Video

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 21 guests