MA for young Tommi

Re: MA for young Tommi

Postby skijim13 » Thu Jan 21, 2016 9:31 am

I agree with you Jeet free foot management of the inside foot by keeping it tucked in would be what I would have him work on the stance gets too wide for a quick balance transfer.
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Re: MA for young Tommi

Postby VAskier » Thu Jan 21, 2016 9:44 am

geoffda wrote:
What we are trying to convey is a completely different way of skiing that only works if all of the movements are available and working together in concert. To get there Tommi would need to totally reinvent his skiing. This isn't a piecemeal thing and it can't be added on to what he is currently doing. We are talking about literally starting over and learning how to ski a whole new way.

Do you understand just how radical the changes are that we are suggesting? If I were coaching Tommi, I'd pull him out of competition for a significant period of time to make this transition. He'd spend weeks learning how to ski all over again before he even had a chance to train gates, let alone compete. Since this thread was created, Tommi's skiing remains fundamentally the same. We've been telling you the same things for years now, but nothing has changed. Why do you keep asking us what we think? Clearly, Tommi's coaches aren't teaching him PMTS principles so it seems highly unlikely that he will develop into the kind of skier that we would produce. If you are posting because you don't like the results you are getting from Tommi's coaches and believe that PMTS will make him into the kind of skier you had hoped him to be, then you need to get serious. Start with Anybody Can Be An Expert Skier 1 and work through that. Then Book 2. Then Essentials of Skiing. If you want to start this process, we'll be more than happy to give you feedback and help as you rebuild Tommi's skiing. Ideally, put up some video of the drills or exercises as you work through them, along with a free skiing run where Tommi tries to demonstrate the movements from the drills in his skiing. If you do that, we can help. But continuing to put up racing footage isn't going to be beneficial. Gates are the last place he should be as he works through the process. While it would be ideal to keep him from racing, there may be all sorts of reasons why that isn't practical. Just understand that you don't develop skiing in the gates and that his results will likely suffer during this process. In any event, we're clearly going around in circles with the race footage approach. At this point, I think the only way this thread can continue is if you put up footage showing Tommi actually trying to develop a specific movement in his skiing and let us give you feedback on that.


It seems to me that this post from geoffda is still applicable.

PMTS experts, please correct me if I am wrong.
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Re: MA for young Tommi

Postby Jeet » Thu Jan 21, 2016 9:56 am

Check this post out to see what we / I mean about tucking the free foot right next to the stance foot.

Some AWESOME pics of Mr Harb, Diana and Helluva (forgive me if there are other pics of people I have not mentioned). In Helluvas pic, it's easier to see, he is fully balance on the stance skii whilst the free foot is tucked next to the stance leg.

http://pmts.org/pmtsforum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=4562

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Re: MA for young Tommi

Postby DougD » Fri Jan 22, 2016 4:07 am

+1 VAskier
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Re: MA for young Tommi

Postby blackthorn » Fri Jan 22, 2016 1:51 pm

The refrain "go to page 1, ACBAES 1 " etc applies.
From my nonexpert perspective Tommi seems to have some good movements, but within a poor framework. It appears to me that he needs to concentrate on balance, and then redevelop these, and other, movements. This means going back to the basics. Unless he receives rehabilitation it is unlikely that his skiing will develop in a PMTS direction.
It was great to hear all the cheering going on. There is some good stuff in earlier threads about teaching children, and also some salient comments from Michaela Schiffrin's parents about focusing on skills at this stage and not worrying about outcomes ie winning races.
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Re: MA for young Tommi

Postby mardale » Fri Jan 22, 2016 6:04 pm

let me try my hand...

looking at the last few turns in the free ski video...

Not a lot of bad things going on here... his tipping effort is quite impressive given that wide stance... you really need to work on that wide stance! I assume his coaches like it though... so you may have a hard time getting him out of it, but it slows everything down, reduces balance and makes tipping quite difficult.

His flexing is inconsistent, but not bad when he nails it.

At speed he's doing ok - but I would slow him down a lot whenever I'd have the chance, to contrast with his other training and focus on movement pattern, develop his balance on the outside ski etc.... sounds familiar?

It's best to put up some attempts at basic drills though, some basic phantoms etc...? To see his movement pattern when he's not at speed.
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Re: MA for young Tommi

Postby Ancient » Sat Jan 07, 2017 10:44 am

Now Tommi's 10 years old and had started the slalom discipline: this is one of the first run: how would you evaluate it?



Thanks in advance.

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Re: MA for young Tommi

Postby rnordell » Mon Jan 09, 2017 3:20 pm

Work more on an "inside hand clear". Tommi's upper body is not close enough to the gate (center of mass needs to be inside the gate) for an effective "outside hand clear" (ie. cross-block). By "cross-blocking" ineffectively he loses any counteracting that he is fighting to get when he squares his upper body up to his skis as he reaches for the gate. Once his skiing develops to the point and he is generating the angles necessary so his upper body is well inside the path of the gate, then an outside clear (cross-block) is simply raising the outside hand to contact the gate. He is then not reaching for the gate, and his hands should not need to cross the zipper line on his jacket.
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Re: MA for young Tommi

Postby HeluvaSkier » Tue Jan 10, 2017 10:54 pm

Watched a bunch of the skiing on your Vimeo channel... T and A both too much up in every turn shape/type and very little direction change as a result. Not tipping with their feet... not skiing with their ankles and no flexing to allow it to happen. Same thing I said mid-2013.
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Re: MA for young Tommi

Postby Ancient » Mon Mar 13, 2017 6:14 am

HeluvaSkier wrote:Watched a bunch of the skiing on your Vimeo channel... T and A both too much up in every turn shape/type and very little direction change as a result. Not tipping with their feet... not skiing with their ankles and no flexing to allow it to happen. Same thing I said mid-2013.


Dear Heluva,

I know that only a few days have passed by, but it seems to me that some improvement has been mastered by A: what do you think?



Cheers and thanks in advance.

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Re: MA for young Tommi

Postby Ancient » Mon Mar 13, 2017 8:59 am

And also T, to my eyes looks in better shape:



Thanks for all the advice.
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Re: MA for young Tommi

Postby Ancient » Mon Apr 10, 2017 4:59 am

Analysing this video frame by frame it seems to me that some improvement has been mastered by Tommi:



What you think?

Thanks in advance.

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Re: MA for young Tommi

Postby Basil j » Mon Apr 10, 2017 12:42 pm

Can you get him out of the gates and practicing with brushes or stubbies? Cross blocking at this age can really lead to bad habits with young racers.
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Re: MA for young Tommi

Postby Ancient » Tue Apr 11, 2017 12:59 am

Basil j wrote:Can you get him out of the gates and practicing with brushes or stubbies? Cross blocking at this age can really lead to bad habits with young racers.


Basil j, you are certainly right; during the summer skiing program some free skiing work will be performed by Tommi's coach in order to improve the technique. But apart from that I can see some good things in the posted video in terms of counterbalance, counteract and inside foot management: am I wrong?

Cheers.

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Re: MA for young Tommi

Postby Jjmdane » Tue Apr 18, 2017 4:42 am

I know this is not practical, but the best way for Tommi to intigrate PMTS movements into his skiing is to ski behind someone who skis with correct PMTS technique. The subconscious is much more powerful than the conscious mind and Tommi would start to mimic the correct technique without realizing it. Obviously it would be beneficial to explain the differences between how Tommi skis now and how he should ski,so hopefully he eventually quantify the new "feels" and become his own coach to compliment his outside coaching. I have done this with young skiers and it seems to work quite well however I understand the logistical problems in seeking this type of solution.
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