The conversion and realization of PSIA instructors

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Re: The conversion and realization of PSIA instructors

Postby hyper_squirrel7 » Wed May 13, 2015 2:26 pm

In all fairness to the instructors mentioned who can't pass level 3, it is really difficult to learn to/be able to ski like that. Not that PMTS (or skiing in general) is easy, but it's certainly more attainable perhaps because it is more "natural." The skiing shown in those videos is just awkward feeling and counterintuitive.
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Re: The conversion and realization of PSIA instructors

Postby BigE » Wed May 13, 2015 4:01 pm

To me, skiing like that qualifies as "stupid human tricks".

Just because you can ski that way does not mean you should ski that way.
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Re: The conversion and realization of PSIA instructors

Postby hyper_squirrel7 » Wed May 13, 2015 7:27 pm

DougD wrote:Jim,

The video you just posted is both comical and frightening, particularly the demo at 0:51-54. The PSIA is actively demonstrating and teaching movements that damage or destroy connective tissues in our knees. Forget the skiing, why aren't orthopedic surgeons and physical therapists protesting en masse?


It also looks dumb and embarrassing. I wouldn't want to be caught in public doing it :|
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Re: The conversion and realization of PSIA instructors

Postby CO_Steve » Wed May 13, 2015 8:51 pm

In the short turns video not every skier was skiing with a big up move. There were a couple later on that appeared to be flexing to release. It wasn't true pmts but it was clearly different than the others. How do they resolve this difference? Could you pass the exam flexing into the turn? Is either ok in that world?
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Re: The conversion and realization of PSIA instructors

Postby skijim13 » Thu May 14, 2015 4:33 am

Weather you can pass with flexing into a turn depends on the examiner, they read off a list of what they want to see and everyone sees something different. Once you learn PMTS you stop giving money to the PSIA and just keep your current level. Lorie and I have to go to something to keep our certification, it will be funny to see what they say about us we do not look like PSIA skiers anymore.

Here is another fun Level III task

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Re: The conversion and realization of PSIA instructors

Postby DougD » Thu May 14, 2015 6:15 am

A Taos instructor had my ski week group doing those a few years ago. It was actually kind of fun.

Of course the real challenge is to do them with CA. The skis perform better, naturally, but it eliminates all ability to see where you're going. :shock:

Swivelling the torso and head with the skis in order to see (as the skiers in the video were doing) is cheating and makes the task rather pointless - just like skiing forward without CA.
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Re: The conversion and realization of PSIA instructors

Postby skijim13 » Thu May 14, 2015 6:43 am

True Doug, Pivot slips would be a good drill if you released your edges and allowed the tips to go naturally downhill without adding steering.
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Re: The conversion and realization of PSIA instructors

Postby DougD » Thu May 14, 2015 6:55 am

skijim13 wrote:Pivot slips would be a good drill if you released your edges and allowed the tips to go naturally downhill without adding steering.

But that would be a TFR!
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Re: The conversion and realization of PSIA instructors

Postby skijim13 » Thu May 14, 2015 8:22 am

I agree Doug. If the PSIA taught a drill as good as the TFR it would improve peoples skiing. The TFR move teaches tipping on and off the edges, teaches the required shift in balance, control of the upper body. Add to that drill engagement and you have a single turn that the student can use to connect turns. Done slowly it allows you to trouble shoot the release. When I was in college I had as a summer job fixing computers since a computer is impossible to fix at high speed we had a box that allowed us to step the program through slowly, this enabled us to find the problem. To me the TFR done slowly enables a similar process and allows a person to trouble shoot their release. The PSIAs solution to a problem in a person skiing is to give them drills to work on without any real determination where the problem is.
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Re: The conversion and realization of PSIA instructors

Postby Max_501 » Thu May 14, 2015 8:29 am

skijim13 wrote:True Doug, Pivot slips would be a good drill if you released your edges and allowed the tips to go naturally downhill without adding steering.


= Two Footed Release drill.
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Re: The conversion and realization of PSIA instructors

Postby hyper_squirrel7 » Thu May 14, 2015 8:27 pm

skijim13 wrote:Weather you can pass with flexing into a turn depends on the examiner, they read off a list of what they want to see and everyone sees something different. Once you learn PMTS you stop giving money to the PSIA and just keep your current level. Lorie and I have to go to something to keep our certification, it will be funny to see what they say about us we do not look like PSIA skiers anymore.

Here is another fun Level III task



Those turns aren't even parallel though. They're in a reverse wedge over half the time
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Re: The conversion and realization of PSIA instructors

Postby h.harb » Wed May 27, 2015 11:15 am

Well done, this is an accurate account of what happens in PSIA and why it will always fail to bring people to the expert level. The PSIA Demo Team members in these videos are not expert skiers, because they only have one turn, a skidded wedge christie.
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Re: The conversion and realization of PSIA instructors

Postby h.harb » Wed May 27, 2015 2:06 pm

Just think of this reality. A PSIA instructor decides to learn PMTS skiing. All of a sudden he gets performance, his skis stay parallel and he has a rounded arc, building angles. Now try to conceive of the reverse. A PMTS Blue Level skier or instructor tries to ski with PSIA technique? How long would you try to make that work, when every time you go out, your skis almost cross, you are in the back seat and you have to stop a skid by jamming your edges at the end of every turn. I think about half a run would do me in.
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