Late hit and edge set skiing!

[romeomike]

definitely missing some essentials... but as far as what i would like to look like as skier, out of all the 30 or so instructional DVD's I have he is the strongest at everything I have seen... and his versatility...

[HeluvaSkier]

definitely missing some essentials... but as far as what i would like to look like as skier, out of all the 30 or so instructional DVD's I have he is the strongest at everything I have seen... and his versatility...

Hm... I don't know that your opinion will score you any points around here.

The best thing about the Essentials is that it isn't built around a skier. Harald is no doubt a great skier, but the Essentials are built from strong movement patterns that he and anyone else can use in their skiing. When evaluating an instructional DVD you should look not only at the skiing being done, but the teaching content that goes along with it. Ideally you should be able to use the information to reach that level of skiing - or higher if you're dedicated enough. Instructional DVD's should not be just about showing off awesome skiing, but providing instructional content that matches the skiing. If you don't see the value in that then you're missing the point.

[romeomike]

all the top DVD's I have, all have solid progressions to get you skiing the way that they are demonstrating, and skiing... Their DVD's are about how they think you should do it... Essentials is a great DVD.... havent said that is wasnt... and im sorry if i came across the wrong way... not trying to argue whats better... just wanted to let people know who the people in the DVD's were because i have them... And as a passing note was just saying that Ritchie is my favourite skier and have found that I really appreciate what content is on the 3 DVD's I have from him... that is all... not trying to get anyone aroused here.. this is my last intent... just sharing information...

[Max_501]

And as a passing note was just saying that Ritchie is my favourite skier...

He's one of my favorite skiers too. The guy just rips.

[ginaliam]

I think what the videos have shown is that Berger dabbles in a lot of different styles-and I'm sure he has strong pedagogical and tactical reasons for doing so (I love his skiing as well-he rips for sure-great bump skier!). Harald , on the other hand also rips all over the mountain, but his videos demonstrate that he is a Hallmark of consistency in style and technique. That, in many ways is the Fundamental difference between Harald's approach and many other coaches'
approaches to free-skiing.

But, I also get that this is the PMTS forum, and Harald pays the bills around here-so it is no surprise that the skiing that more closely resembles the PMTS model will be lauded and the skiing that doesn't will be discouraged. Looking for models that embody the turn techniques being taught by PMTS is the goal since the reason for the forum and the attraction of the forum is a direct connection to learning PMTS.

A lot of Berger's stuff certainly fits the PMTS bill-some of his other stuff apparently doesn't. That in no way diminishes him as a skier or an instructor-But I understand Harald looks to forward his students learning of PMTS with models that demonstrate the essentials of PMTS in their entirety.

I must admit, watching one of those videos, it caused me a twinge of pain to watch a skier as talented as berger demonstrate, in prolonged slow-motion segments, linked wedge turns (though they were followed by demonstrations of beating the wedge turn by pulling in and controlling the free foot so I get the progression and see the similarities). But like I said, I've been a long time admirer of Berger's inspiring 'elegant' skiing (and Harald's skiing).


The Elegant skiing DVD is a Three Part set?? Do they exist in English or still only in Japanese?

It'd be fun to have those AND Harald's forthcoming Free-Skiing DVD!

[h.harb]

But, I also get that this is the PMTS forum, and Harald pays the bills around here-so it is no surprise that the skiing that more closely resembles the PMTS model will be lauded and the skiing that doesn't will be discouraged.

I'm sorry that after all this time on the forum you have missed the essence of the MA, movements and skiing. PMTS is not a system, PMTS is skiing developed to it's most efficient level. PMTS is simply a name, and it does not, at the highest levels of skiing performance, represent my or any teaching system. It represents the way the most efficient skiers perform. I have simple identified it, written it and demonstrated it.

And PMTS movements have every thing to do with switching models, styles of turns or types of turns. When I ski either an "edge set" style, a hopping style, a PSIA turn or a race turn; my basic technique and movements don't lose quality and a good skier's movements should not show flaws when doing this. And I'm not representing my way of skiing in PMTS. My personal style is how I ski, is me. I skied this way long before PMTS became an acronym. A quality skier, if he changes types of turns, or demonstrates something, should not in any of these circumstances have to degrade the quality of his movements or turns. Unless there is a basic flaw. Berger does!
I am sorry to burst some bubbles here, that some may not want to acknowledge, but I think if you watch the video and movements, Berger has flaws. Especially when you compare him to the PMTS model as described.

[Bolter]

Demo this or Demo that who cares! What works is the point. Essentials work. Extention, steering, knee drive, skiing square, two footed, leaning and rotation does not.

MA is the most important skill a coach/teacher has. PMTS/Essentials makes this a lot easier because there are identifiable movement standards. Harald uses a microscope while most of us are squinting through foggy goggles.

If you do the drills, you will ski better.

JR

[h.harb]

If you are judging Berger based on all the skiing demos that were shown, then he may well have "flaws" relative to the PMTS ideal. But I have to believe that somebody with Berger's skills can demo PMTS style skiing as close to perfection as anyone. If he could not do that, there is ZERO hope for the rest of us!

I don't think you get it, there is not such thing as PMTS skiing, skiing well, is skiing well, mistakes are mistakes, no matter what system. Berger's skiing I put up in photos shows skiing mistakes, not PMTS mistakes. You guys don't get it. PMTS is movements, and it defines the best movements, if Berger has mistakes, like big toe edge and rotation they are what they are.

[h.harb]

Would I correct the mistakes I see in Berger if they appeared in one of our coaches? Of course, so what makes Berger any different? Would I correct them in our campers, of course. A skier that can ski without the mistakes Beeger shows will get better faster.

[BigE]

Right on Harald!

Mistakes are mistakes no matter what. If Berger is making mistakes, it is because he is making movements that don't belong in expert skiing. It so happens that those movements are not within PMTS as well. But that's no surprise -- a good teaching system does not teach mistakes.

Why would any system that purports to teach expert skiing allow the student to ski using sub-standard movements? Why teach these mistakes? Why teach extension, rotary push off, two legged skiing, wedge entry, knee drive, extend to release, leaning and wide stance? Especially when their target skier examples are all tipping, narrow stanced, counter balancing, counteracting, flex to release, one-legged skiers? I don't get it.

[milesb]

....I don't think you get it, there is no such thing as PMTS skiing,...

For most of us there IS such a thing because we see it on the hill so seldom that it stands out as someone who has studied PMTS.

[jclayton]

I think we can cut Ritchie some slack , some demos for sure were done after a long night fighting off ( or not ) thousands of Japanese women fans and drinking Suntory whiskey . What with those blond locks, blue eyes and square cut features .

I'm surprised he could even stand up !

[MonsterMan]

PMTS is not a system, PMTS is skiing developed to it's most efficient level. PMTS is simply a name, and it does not, at the highest levels of skiing performance, represent my or any teaching system. It represents the way the most efficient skiers perform. I have simple identified it, written it and demonstrated it.

This is Rolled Gold! and should be a sticky or in a "classic quotes" section.

[h.harb]

Just because Berger is a great skier, why shouldn’t he be allowed to get better? How would you feel if I was coaching you and I saw you ski with Berger’s mistakes and I didn’t address them? No Need to address those mistakes because Berger makes the same mistakes. So it is OK for you to make those mistakes?

If I used that reasoning, what would I do if a skier said to me. “ Please work on my skiing except for the knee drive and squaring up of my upper body at the end of turns, that’s OK, because Berger does it.

Sure he’s a good athlete, he can get away with it. I had knee drive on my right leg when I was racing. No one told me. I saw it when video became more used in skiing. I tried to fix it, due to my alignment it comes and goes. When I am out of balance it sometimes comes back. It hurts my knee when it happens.

Max501 has right knee dropping in issues, we worked on them, we addressed them, we aligned the leg best we could, he worked on the movements to improve hip counter range of movement. It became much better. Should we have left it alone just because Berger does it?

Addressing movement breakdown is what coaching is about, unless you aren’t seeing it, if you aren’t addressing it. It should be encouraging for skiers to see that even the best skiers make similar errors as they have. They get around them through athletic ability, the mistakes are still there.

[h.harb]

I never said Berger couldn't adjust for his mistakes, or that he could not cure them completely. I'm sure he would be grateful if some one could point them out to him and give him a cure.